AAR: Combat Carbine Teamwork, March 2

[cmshoot]

Great bunch of folks and excellent weather.

As normal in most classes, several folks found that some of the gear that they thought would be good stuff didn’t actually work for them. In one case, this included the student’s SCAR-16.

The biggest thing that students took away from them was the importance of effective communication. Communication doesn’t have to be verbal, but when using verbals, it’s important to be clear. The speaker may think they are being clear, because they know the thought they are attempting to convey, but the words they chose often aren’t clear to their partner.

Students found how difficult it was to communicate effectively when separated by only 20’-30’ of distance, due to stress and the gunfire. It will be even worse with the increased stress of a deadly force encounter and the gunfire aimed in their direction.

Be cognizant of where your partner is at all times, as well as their status. Excellent idea to verbally communicate with your partner when you have a stoppage/malfunction/reload, as long as you use “proper” verbals. Something like “Drill” is excellent, but shouting out stuff like “I’m out of ammo!”, “My gun is jammed!”, or similar is not a good idea.

Being able to use all the weapons that your partner uses, and vice versa, is a very good idea. You may end up having to use them, or to assist your partner if they have an issue.

Semper Fi!

 

[Lazarus]

Great bunch of folks and excellent weather.

As normal in most classes, several folks found that some of the gear that they thought would be good stuff didn’t actually work for them. In one case, this included the student’s SCAR-16.

Semper Fi!

One of the reasons I want to do some training this year.

 

[cmshoot]

One of the reasons I want to do some training this year.

Never fails! Happened to me more times than I can remember.

 

[Lazarus]

Never fails! Happened to me more times than I can remember.

I honestly wouldn’t think a rifle like a SCAR would have any issues. I buy what I believe to be quality guns but I guess the rigors of a class really puts things to the test.

 

[cmshoot]

I honestly wouldn’t think a rifle like a SCAR would have any issues. I buy what I believe to be quality guns but I guess the rigors of a class really puts things to the test.

There was nothing wrong with the SCAR itself, it was just the wrong platform for the student in question. The SCAR is long and heavy, compared to some 16” AR’s I have built and seen. The FN wasn’t the right gun for the student that brought it. A shorter LOP may have helped a lot, and the weight was an issue as the day wore on.

I weighed 2 AR’s that I have in the safe; one is a build that my daughter and I did for her, and the other is a DDv7LW that has had a few upgrades done by me. They both weighed roughly what the SCAR-16S weighs naked, but they were equipped with slings, optics, and lights.

So, nothing wrong with the SCAR-16S, it just wasn’t the right platform for the student that brought it. I am currently working with her and her husband to modify one of their existing AR’s to better fit her.

I don’t think she will have any issues with a properly outfitted 16” AR, but if she does, I’m going to talk to her about building a 11.5” pistol with a sturdy brace.

I’ve had a lot of SCAR’s of both flavors in my courses over the years, in everything from Combat Carbine to my 1,000yd Basic Precision Rifle Course. I’ve only ever seen one that had a problem, a SCAR-16, but I did not attempt to diagnose what the issue was. For all I know, it was not properly maintained, or it was poorly modified, or the user was inducing the malfunctions.

 

[Lazarus]

There was nothing wrong with the SCAR itself, it was just the wrong platform for the student in question. The SCAR is long and heavy, compared to some 16” AR’s I have built and seen. The FN wasn’t the right gun for the student that brought it. A shorter LOP may have helped a lot, and the weight was an issue as the day wore on.

I weighed 2 AR’s that I have in the safe; one is a build that my daughter and I did for her, and the other is a DDv7LW that has had a few upgrades done by me. They both weighed roughly what the SCAR-16S weighs naked, but they were equipped with slings, optics, and lights.

So, nothing wrong with the SCAR-16S, it just wasn’t the right platform for the student that brought it. I am currently working with her and her husband to modify one of their existing AR’s to better fit her.

I don’t think she will have any issues with a properly outfitted 16” AR, but if she does, I’m going to talk to her about building a 11.5” pistol with a sturdy brace.

I’ve had a lot of SCAR’s of both flavors in my courses over the years, in everything from Combat Carbine to my 1,000yd Basic Precision Rifle Course. I’ve only ever seen one that had a problem, a SCAR-16, but I did not attempt to diagnose what the issue was. For all I know, it was not properly maintained, or it was poorly modified, or the user was inducing the malfunctions.

Oh I understand what you're saying.

Thats like when I got my plate carrier I set it up based on a picture I saw, not really taking into account my body mechanics during reloads or any other practicality. After time practicing reloads, especially with the rifle shouldered and using a sling, I realized I needed to change the position of my mag pouches. I had pistol pouches on my left side and rifle pouches on my right. It felt like it took too much effort to get to those rifle mags. Also thinking realistically I would exhaust my rifle before needing to reload my pistol, even if that wasn't the case, if I transitioned to pistol and need to reload I wouldnt have the rifle on that right side so it just seem to make more sense with the rifle mags on the left side.

If that makes any sense. I guess what it boils down to is you can have an idea of what or how your gear selection should perform but until you actually practice or train with it you never know how effective or ineffective its going to be.

 

[cmshoot]

Oh I understand what you're saying.

Thats like when I got my plate carrier I set it up based on a picture I saw, not really taking into account my body mechanics during reloads or any other practicality. After time practicing reloads, especially with the rifle shouldered and using a sling, I realized I needed to change the position of my mag pouches. I had pistol pouches on my left side and rifle pouches on my right. It felt like it took too much effort to get to those rifle mags. Also thinking realistically I would exhaust my rifle before needing to reload my pistol, even if that wasn't the case, if I transitioned to pistol and need to reload I wouldnt have the rifle on that right side so it just seem to make more sense with the rifle mags on the left side.

If that makes any sense. I guess what it boils down to is you can have an idea of what or how your gear selection should perform but until you actually practice or train with it you never know how effective or ineffective its going to be.

I’ve run the same battle belt/plate carrier setup for a decade. I thought I had all the kinks worked out. All my mags and kit go on my my belt. I have 4 mag pouches across my chest, but I leave them empty; rifle mags are on my left hip and my pistol mags are just in front of it.

I was demo’ing a drill in front of my students and happened to be shooting around the left side of cover, so I had transitioned my M4 over to my left shoulder. My M4 ran empty, so I immediately ducked behind cover and reached across my body with my right hand to grab a fresh mag. I found that while wearing my plate carrier, I couldn’t reach my mags with my right hand. I swapped my M4 to my right shoulder, did a standard reload, and popped around the right side of cover to finish the drill.

Once I was done with the demo, I told my students what happened and how important it is to shake your gear out. From then on, every time I don my plate carrier I place one magazine in the center pouch on the front of the carrier where I can get to it with my right hand.

 

[Lazarus]

I’ve run the same battle belt/plate carrier setup for a decade. I thought I had all the kinks worked out. All my mags and kit go on my my belt. I have 4 mag pouches across my chest, but I leave them empty; rifle mags are on my left hip and my pistol mags are just in front of it.

I was demo’ing a drill in front of my students and happened to be shooting around the left side of cover, so I had transitioned my M4 over to my left shoulder. My M4 ran empty, so I immediately ducked behind cover and reached across my body with my right hand to grab a fresh mag. I found that while wearing my plate carrier, I couldn’t reach my mags with my right hand. I swapped my M4 to my right shoulder, did a standard reload, and popped around the right side of cover to finish the drill.

Once I was done with the demo, I told my students what happened and how important it is to shake your gear out. From then on, every time I don my plate carrier I place one magazine in the center pouch on the front of the carrier where I can get to it with my right hand.

Wow. Was that your first time doing a reload in that position? I know ever since watching way of the gun and see how those characters had to reload while wounded it kinda makes me think about those extenuating circumstances where you're in an awkward position or wounded and having to do one handed manipulations etc.

Why don't you run any mags on your carrier?

 

[cmshoot]

Wow. Was that your first time doing a reload in that position? I know ever since watching way of the gun and see how those characters had to reload while wounded it kinda makes me think about those extenuating circumstances where you're in an awkward position or wounded and having to do one handed manipulations etc.

Why don't you run any mags on your carrier?

I’ve done a lot of reloads from the left shoulder, but apparently I had never done it while wearing my plate carrier. Without the plate carrier I can reach across my body and grab a mag with no issues.

I don’t always wear a plate carrier. I hate wearing armor and prefer to go without. I tend to wear it in classes where it’s hot and the majority of my students are wearing them; it helps me gauge how the students are feeling. I always wear it when teaching LE and military classes.

I don’t like having a bunch of gear on the front of my body......it keeps me from going belly down and getting as low as possible. Also, when low crawling around those magazine catch on everything and the pouches pick up all sorts of crud.

My normal loadout is a 30rd PMag in the gun and 2 more on my belt. I’m not running around Iraq.......if I can’t get it done with 90rds I’m in a world of hurt!

 

[Lazarus]

I’ve done a lot of reloads from the left shoulder, but apparently I had never done it while wearing my plate carrier. Without the plate carrier I can reach across my body and grab a mag with no issues.

I don’t always wear a plate carrier. I hate wearing armor and prefer to go without. I tend to wear it in classes where it’s hot and the majority of my students are wearing them; it helps me gauge how the students are feeling. I always wear it when teaching LE and military classes.

I don’t like having a bunch of gear on the front of my body......it keeps me from going belly down and getting as low as possible. Also, when low crawling around those magazine catch on everything and the pouches pick up all sorts of crud.

My normal loadout is a 30rd PMag in the gun and 2 more on my belt. I’m not running around Iraq.......if I can’t get it done with 90rds I’m in a world of hurt!

Ok thats what I thought. I brought my gear from a member on here and he had double HSGI tacos and thats a lot to have in front. Even with single stack I can see what you're saying.