Having just sold the Panzer AR12 that I had been holding onto for a while (Gen 2 with the plastic AR carrying handle and front sight), and never fired, I was looking for something similar but available at a similar price. What I liked about the pictures of the Armagon G12 that I was seeing, was it appeared to be more AR-15 like in the lower receiver area. The Panzer AR12 was less AR-15 looking except for the carry handle and front sight tower that came with the Gen 2. Actually, let me clarify that. It wasn't that is was less AR-15 like, but the earlier guns all had fixed stocks that resembled AR-15's fixed stocks, yet were integral with the lower receiver. Like a Cavalry Arms AR-15 lower unit. So you knew there was no opportunity to change the stock style. The G12 actually comes with an AR-15 carbine stock tube. The stock they include doesn't look terrible, but it doesn't have much padding on the butt. I just happen to have a thick padded AR carbine stock that cost me right at $25.00 and wanted to try it out. I had always imagined it would be a good choice for the .308's and 12 gauge AR styles. Finally I had the opportunity to test my theory. The Turkish shotguns were leaning more and more towards AR-15 features.
Starting with the original Turkish 12 gauge MKA 1919, and the Leader Arms AR12, those appeared to have some break in reliability issues. They were styled to look very much like an AR-15 on steroids, but had some problems. I recall Ben at Classic Arms being disappointed and actually featuring a video, where they were "Blowing them out" with the caveat that they had some reliability issues. Consider the MKA 1919 the First Gen models of combat shotguns from Turkey. There may have been some earlier attempts but the MKA 1919 is what came onto my radar finally. Then the AR12 quickly came in, probably in parallel, to the point that is was confusing on who was making what. They all looked to have design lineage , but there were slight styling upgrades and different manufacturers.
There have been many good products out of Turkish Firearms companies. The Zenith series of rifles and pistols have proven well made and very reliable. Tim from the Military Arms Channel actually visited the facility and was able to inspect and shoot some of their latest military rifles which is kinda his area of interest. Tim actually likes all guns, but he loves his Assault Rifles. The good things about Turkish Arms makers appears that they listen to customer feedback and will make efforts to improve their products.
So the Panzer line of shotgun has now enjoyed some upgrades and restyling, so much so, that at times it is hard to keep up with which model is there latest. And apparently some design concepts have been shared or sold to other manufacturers in Turkey who are making similar designs.
That brings me back to the Armagon G12. The gun claims to be by Anatolio Manufacturing Co LLC out of Orlando, Florida. But the aluminum upper receiver clearly says it is from Turkey. So it appears that Anatolio makes the plastic AR styled lower and marry them to aluminum 12 gauge uppers made in Turkey. Not a bad idea. But for a while they were running at $499.00 when Turkish Panzers were going for $389.00, at least at one point. Then I noticed Centerfire was offering the G12 at $399.00, I decided to take a chance and try one.
I have to say that I like it, although it does not present itself as well made as the Panzer AR12 series. The forward hand guards are all plastic, with no heat shield. While this holds down weight, it makes me wonder how durable they will prove to be. The Panzer AR12 has a nice aluminum hand guard which imparts much more confidence and appearance of quality. Of course it adds weight too. The lower receiver is plastic, and has two HK style captured pins that keep the upper and lower locked together just like an AR-15. The safety lever is plastic, but the internal fire control parts appear to me metal. There is a bolt hold open and bolt release paddle that is exactly like an AR-15. It is NOT interchangeable with AR-15 bolt hold opens. The trigger, hammer and sear are all metal. The trigger release is single stage and is pretty good. Not target grade, but for the intended purposes of this shotgun, it is crisp and clean. The mag release is metal and the stock tube is metal, but after that, the rest of the receiver is pretty much all plastic. The rear of the receiver does not appear to have any metal inserts and the buffer tube simply screws into a beefy area of plastic. The front take down pivot area is also just a generous amount of plastic. I know that the Armalite AR-180B had issues with their all plastic pivot pin area, so I hope that that does not transpire with this shotgun? I would suggest handling the disassembly process with care and not let the lower and upper slam open or pivot too hard against each other. The leverage would probably eventually lead to fractures in the plastic. There is a plastic feed ramp build into the front of the mag well to guide the cartridges into the chamber. It is plastic as well. It is somewhat fragile looking when the upper and lower are apart, but once mated and closed, it enjoys support from the aluminum upper.
The full length picatinny rail on the gun is aluminum all the way. The receiver of course has it integrally cast and then machined into the upper. It can not be removed it you don't want it there, unless you know someone willing to machine it off. The forward hand guard, has aluminum rails. The top rail is installed as it comes in the box, but it could be removed. There are three screws and nuts holding it to the upper hand guard. There are two accessory rails in the box with a small bag of screws and nuts for attachment. You have to undo the hand guards, which is not hard at all, and then install them on each side of the upper hand guard. They have a somewhat softened edge, but only just adequate in my opinion. So many of these accessory rails can have very sharp edges and can teat or cut your hands if handled roughly. I would like to see more manufactures round their rail ends and soften the sharp edges to reduce damaging exposed skin. I may just take a Dremel to them and make them better, but that will take the black oxide finish off of them. There is always rattle can patch up.
The gun comes with NO sights. I kinda liked the old plastic AR carry handle and front sight post that Panzer used to offer, but will probably end up with some form of red dot. Oh, and they do have changeable chokes internally at the muzzle. One is installed and two more, with tool to change them, come in a small plastic box.
The thing I liked BEST about this shotgun, once I got it to the range, is with a reasonably stout field load (Winchester AA 2 3/4" 3 Dram Equivalent, 1 1/8oz. 7 1/2 shot) at only a little over $7.00 a box, it ran 100%. I did oil the mechanism before taking it to the range. You have more success usually if you oil up a new gun during break in. I had expected some issues, as these Turkish guns all recommend a break in period of really heavy, high brass, 3" shells. I also had 5 rounds of 2 3/4" Buck I ran thru. No problems and didn't expect any with those. But I was really impressed that the gun ran on the target load. To be fair, Winchester does refer to them as "heavy target load". But after a few more boxes of that very reasonably priced fodder, I will see how it does on the low brass cheap field loads. In reality, if working with a combat shot gun, one should run potential combat loads thru it, i.e., buck shot or slugs. For a house gun, which I suspect many look at this for, the 7 1/2 shot in a mild recoil is probably a highly considered "house round". Nobody wants to punch through too much drywall.
So with a sigh of relief, it appears to be a decent product. Time will tell and longer term use is in order for sure, but at least I am off to a more confident start than I expected. If you find them at the $400 dollar mark, I would recommend. I don't think I would at the $500 mark. I would prefer to get the Panzer AR12 back at a similar $400 range and feel much better about the overall build quality and longevity of the gun. It may have less modularity, but I believe it would last longer and stay reliable for many years to come. Juries is still out on the Armagon G12.
Ben's AR12 review:
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...130A75ABE7D71DA09CEB130A75ABE7D7&&FORM=VRDGAR
Starting with the original Turkish 12 gauge MKA 1919, and the Leader Arms AR12, those appeared to have some break in reliability issues. They were styled to look very much like an AR-15 on steroids, but had some problems. I recall Ben at Classic Arms being disappointed and actually featuring a video, where they were "Blowing them out" with the caveat that they had some reliability issues. Consider the MKA 1919 the First Gen models of combat shotguns from Turkey. There may have been some earlier attempts but the MKA 1919 is what came onto my radar finally. Then the AR12 quickly came in, probably in parallel, to the point that is was confusing on who was making what. They all looked to have design lineage , but there were slight styling upgrades and different manufacturers.
There have been many good products out of Turkish Firearms companies. The Zenith series of rifles and pistols have proven well made and very reliable. Tim from the Military Arms Channel actually visited the facility and was able to inspect and shoot some of their latest military rifles which is kinda his area of interest. Tim actually likes all guns, but he loves his Assault Rifles. The good things about Turkish Arms makers appears that they listen to customer feedback and will make efforts to improve their products.
So the Panzer line of shotgun has now enjoyed some upgrades and restyling, so much so, that at times it is hard to keep up with which model is there latest. And apparently some design concepts have been shared or sold to other manufacturers in Turkey who are making similar designs.
That brings me back to the Armagon G12. The gun claims to be by Anatolio Manufacturing Co LLC out of Orlando, Florida. But the aluminum upper receiver clearly says it is from Turkey. So it appears that Anatolio makes the plastic AR styled lower and marry them to aluminum 12 gauge uppers made in Turkey. Not a bad idea. But for a while they were running at $499.00 when Turkish Panzers were going for $389.00, at least at one point. Then I noticed Centerfire was offering the G12 at $399.00, I decided to take a chance and try one.
I have to say that I like it, although it does not present itself as well made as the Panzer AR12 series. The forward hand guards are all plastic, with no heat shield. While this holds down weight, it makes me wonder how durable they will prove to be. The Panzer AR12 has a nice aluminum hand guard which imparts much more confidence and appearance of quality. Of course it adds weight too. The lower receiver is plastic, and has two HK style captured pins that keep the upper and lower locked together just like an AR-15. The safety lever is plastic, but the internal fire control parts appear to me metal. There is a bolt hold open and bolt release paddle that is exactly like an AR-15. It is NOT interchangeable with AR-15 bolt hold opens. The trigger, hammer and sear are all metal. The trigger release is single stage and is pretty good. Not target grade, but for the intended purposes of this shotgun, it is crisp and clean. The mag release is metal and the stock tube is metal, but after that, the rest of the receiver is pretty much all plastic. The rear of the receiver does not appear to have any metal inserts and the buffer tube simply screws into a beefy area of plastic. The front take down pivot area is also just a generous amount of plastic. I know that the Armalite AR-180B had issues with their all plastic pivot pin area, so I hope that that does not transpire with this shotgun? I would suggest handling the disassembly process with care and not let the lower and upper slam open or pivot too hard against each other. The leverage would probably eventually lead to fractures in the plastic. There is a plastic feed ramp build into the front of the mag well to guide the cartridges into the chamber. It is plastic as well. It is somewhat fragile looking when the upper and lower are apart, but once mated and closed, it enjoys support from the aluminum upper.
The full length picatinny rail on the gun is aluminum all the way. The receiver of course has it integrally cast and then machined into the upper. It can not be removed it you don't want it there, unless you know someone willing to machine it off. The forward hand guard, has aluminum rails. The top rail is installed as it comes in the box, but it could be removed. There are three screws and nuts holding it to the upper hand guard. There are two accessory rails in the box with a small bag of screws and nuts for attachment. You have to undo the hand guards, which is not hard at all, and then install them on each side of the upper hand guard. They have a somewhat softened edge, but only just adequate in my opinion. So many of these accessory rails can have very sharp edges and can teat or cut your hands if handled roughly. I would like to see more manufactures round their rail ends and soften the sharp edges to reduce damaging exposed skin. I may just take a Dremel to them and make them better, but that will take the black oxide finish off of them. There is always rattle can patch up.
The gun comes with NO sights. I kinda liked the old plastic AR carry handle and front sight post that Panzer used to offer, but will probably end up with some form of red dot. Oh, and they do have changeable chokes internally at the muzzle. One is installed and two more, with tool to change them, come in a small plastic box.
The thing I liked BEST about this shotgun, once I got it to the range, is with a reasonably stout field load (Winchester AA 2 3/4" 3 Dram Equivalent, 1 1/8oz. 7 1/2 shot) at only a little over $7.00 a box, it ran 100%. I did oil the mechanism before taking it to the range. You have more success usually if you oil up a new gun during break in. I had expected some issues, as these Turkish guns all recommend a break in period of really heavy, high brass, 3" shells. I also had 5 rounds of 2 3/4" Buck I ran thru. No problems and didn't expect any with those. But I was really impressed that the gun ran on the target load. To be fair, Winchester does refer to them as "heavy target load". But after a few more boxes of that very reasonably priced fodder, I will see how it does on the low brass cheap field loads. In reality, if working with a combat shot gun, one should run potential combat loads thru it, i.e., buck shot or slugs. For a house gun, which I suspect many look at this for, the 7 1/2 shot in a mild recoil is probably a highly considered "house round". Nobody wants to punch through too much drywall.
So with a sigh of relief, it appears to be a decent product. Time will tell and longer term use is in order for sure, but at least I am off to a more confident start than I expected. If you find them at the $400 dollar mark, I would recommend. I don't think I would at the $500 mark. I would prefer to get the Panzer AR12 back at a similar $400 range and feel much better about the overall build quality and longevity of the gun. It may have less modularity, but I believe it would last longer and stay reliable for many years to come. Juries is still out on the Armagon G12.
Ben's AR12 review:
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...130A75ABE7D71DA09CEB130A75ABE7D7&&FORM=VRDGAR
