Disappointed in reloading handbook

[DTM Builder]

Not sure that Lyman's 50th would be any good to you. It does have data for 8mm Mauser and 7.62x54R, but not a lot. And nothing on 7.5x55 Swiss.

Lymans I don't have. It seems that they are all similar sized, volume wise and projectile weights, but about there seems to be only one common powder listed for all three. Of course Academy is useless on that one. Oh well powder valley here I come. Anyone want to split some hazmat fees?

 

[Jackie Graham]

Midway sells caliber specific manuals. I have them for 45acp and 44mag. lots of different bullet and load variations. Mine are 15 years old so they don't have the new powders listed but you can usually find that data listed on the web now days.

 

[FantomKnight]

I know that I'm going to need to come up with several recipes and try them out to determine which one(s) work best in my particular gun(s). However, just starting out, I feel that it would be advantageous to have data for the type of bullet that I'm loading. The pressures depend on the weight of the bullet, the amount of powder used, and the depth at which the bullet is seated. Because of the flattened nose of a JHP, would it not be seated at a lesser depth than an RN bullet in order to achieve the same COL? See, if I use RN rounds and use the JHP load data, would I not possibly seat the bullet too far, resulting in higher than expected pressures?

 

[FantomKnight]

Midway sells caliber specific manuals. I have them for 45acp and 44mag. lots of different bullet and load variations. Mine are 15 years old so they don't have the new powders listed but you can usually find that data listed on the web now days.

I found some caliber specific books on ebay last night, published by a company called LOADBOOKS, I think. I ordered a couple of them for around $8 each. Will see what they have in them. The 9mm one is supposed to have over 1,100 recipes.

 

[kuduman]

You have to learn what's "equivalent" and what changes are safe. Cast bullets, of similar hardness and similar weight, and similar BEARING SURFACE-- number of grooves, essentially-- you can substitute. But those are a lot of things to consider.

JHPs in 9mm and FMJ? If the bearing surface looks similar, so are the loads.

But... this is why you start at the suggested minimum and WORK UP.

And also why you end up with a bookshelf full of books/pamphlets/printouts.

There are far, far too many combinations to have safety and pressure-tested them all. Take 9mm-- dozens of bullet designs, a dozen or more suitable powders, six brands of primers, 100 manufacturers of cases, different hardnesses of lead for the cast bullets (never mind sizes relative to your bore). Call it 2,000,000 combinations to be thorough. That's not going to happen. Or you learn the craft, and how to work up loads. And you get access to a CHRONOGRAPH.

It's a craft and a hobby unto itself. I don't recommend it to just anyone. If one doesn't have a detail-oriented, safety-conscious mindset, and the time to do it right, they shouldn't be fooling around with reloading.

 

[sparked1]

Reloading manuals are overrated.

 

[kuduman]

I know that I'm going to need to come up with several recipes and try them out to determine which one(s) work best in my particular gun(s). However, just starting out, I feel that it would be advantageous to have data for the type of bullet that I'm loading. The pressures depend on the weight of the bullet, the amount of powder used, and the depth at which the bullet is seated. Because of the flattened nose of a JHP, would it not be seated at a lesser depth than an RN bullet in order to achieve the same COL? See, if I use RN rounds and use the JHP load data, would I not possibly seat the bullet too far, resulting in higher than expected pressures?

Here's a tip that's not in the books- the "plunk test". You know the max COAL of the cartridge, of course, as any longer and it won't fit in the magazine. But... some bullets and some BARRELS require seating deeper than the mag length to keep from shoving the bullet into the rifling upon loading. That dramatically raiser pressures. So, the plunk test.

Pull out your barrel (I'm talking pistol; for rifles there are tools for this) and clean the chamber. Load a bullet in a case, dummy or not, at maximum length. Drop it in the chamber. It should drop in with a nice "plunk" sound. All the way in; you shouldn't be able to push it in any further under finger pressure. Also, and this is critical, you should be able to easily rotate the cartridge in place. If it's touching the rifling, it won't turn easily. Try a commercial round, if necessary, to see what the results are supposed to be.

Anyway, if it binds up, reduce the COAL by .050" or whatever, and try again until the cartridge passes. Then do a little bit more for safety. That's your COAL for that cartridge, in that gun. If you have multiple guns in that caliber, you'll quickly figure out if one has a shorter lead-in than the others. If you have a CZ-75, it's that one, for example. They are notorious for this.

Write the results down in your reloading notebook. Which you must have.

Now... it's possible that this won't feed reliably. For that, you'll have to whip up a few and shoot 'em. I've rarely encountered that though.

It is true that changing OAL affects pressure in pistols. THIS IS WHY YOU START LOW AND WORK UP.

And use a chrono to see if the velocity is too high, or wildly inconsistent, both signs of something being very wrong.

Make sure the bullets are crimped enough to make it up the feed ramp without getting shoved into the case, of course. That'll blow your gun up.

The good news is that once you are satisfied, you need not revisit any of this for many, many years as long as you keep using the same components. So pick components that are easy to source. Don't push the envelope until you're quite sure you know what you are doing, and as always be safe.

 

[FantomKnight]

Here's a tip that's not in the books- the "plunk test". You know the max COAL of the cartridge, of course, as any longer and it won't fit in the magazine. But... some bullets and some BARRELS require seating deeper than the mag length to keep from shoving the bullet into the rifling upon loading. That dramatically raiser pressures. So, the plunk test.

Pull out your barrel (I'm talking pistol; for rifles there are tools for this) and clean the chamber. Load a bullet in a case, dummy or not, at maximum length. Drop it in the chamber. It should drop in with a nice "plunk" sound. All the way in; you shouldn't be able to push it in any further under finger pressure. Also, and this is critical, you should be able to easily rotate the cartridge in place. If it's touching the rifling, it won't turn easily. Try a commercial round, if necessary, to see what the results are supposed to be.

Anyway, if it binds up, reduce the COAL by .050" or whatever, and try again until the cartridge passes. Then do a little bit more for safety. That's your COAL for that cartridge, in that gun. If you have multiple guns in that caliber, you'll quickly figure out if one has a shorter lead-in than the others. If you have a CZ-75, it's that one, for example. They are notorious for this.

Write the results down in your reloading notebook. Which you must have.

Now... it's possible that this won't feed reliably. For that, you'll have to whip up a few and shoot 'em. I've rarely encountered that though.

It is true that changing OAL affects pressure in pistols. THIS IS WHY YOU START LOW AND WORK UP.

And use a chrono to see if the velocity is too high, or wildly inconsistent, both signs of something being very wrong.

Make sure the bullets are crimped enough to make it up the feed ramp without getting shoved into the case, of course. That'll blow your gun up.

The good news is that once you are satisfied, you need not revisit any of this for many, many years as long as you keep using the same components. So pick components that are easy to source. Don't push the envelope until you're quite sure you know what you are doing, and as always be safe.

I appreciate that. I have read about the "plunk test". But, they did not say to try rotating the round. They just said that it should easily fall in with a noticeable "plunk", and then easily come back out again. And, also thanks for the note about CZs. Two of the guns that I shoot most often are a CZ 75 P-01 and an SP-01 Tactical.

 

[Greybeard]

You have to learn what's "equivalent" and what changes are safe. Cast bullets, of similar hardness and similar weight, and similar BEARING SURFACE-- number of grooves, essentially-- you can substitute. But those are a lot of things to consider.

JHPs in 9mm and FMJ? If the bearing surface looks similar, so are the loads.

But... this is why you start at the suggested minimum and WORK UP.

And also why you end up with a bookshelf full of books/pamphlets/printouts.

There are far, far too many combinations to have safety and pressure-tested them all. Take 9mm-- dozens of bullet designs, a dozen or more suitable powders, six brands of primers, 100 manufacturers of cases, different hardnesses of lead for the cast bullets (never mind sizes relative to your bore). Call it 2,000,000 combinations to be thorough. That's not going to happen. Or you learn the craft, and how to work up loads. And you get access to a CHRONOGRAPH.

It's a craft and a hobby unto itself. I don't recommend it to just anyone. If one doesn't have a detail-oriented, safety-conscious mindset, and the time to do it right, they shouldn't be fooling around with reloading.

^^^^^^^^
Yep, get to know what works and read and compare the published data, then reduce a little and load what works for you.

 

[kuduman]

I appreciate that. I have read about the "plunk test". But, they did not say to try rotating the round. They just said that it should easily fall in with a noticeable "plunk", and then easily come back out again. And, also thanks for the note about CZs. Two of the guns that I shoot most often are a CZ 75 P-01 and an SP-01 Tactical.

Oh yeah-- you'll have to be careful with the CZs. They are designed (chambered) specifically for the 124 gr. NATO FMJ round, and the more you deviate from that profile, the more careful you need to be. My 124 gr. cast lead loads are a good .100" shorter than the book length, so they'll not jam in the lands of my CZ Tactical Sport. So case capacity is well below what the books suggest, and therefore pressures are higher. And my charge weight is well under book max. They're so short folks comment on how funny they look. But they run in all my 9s, so I don't have to produce different loads for different guns. Thank goodness.

Lots o' stuff to learn. Fun, if you're a science nerd like me.

Oh, BTW, there are gunsmiths out there that will ream your CZ barrel to fit whatever bullet you want. You send 'em the barrel, a dummy cartridge, and like $30, and they'll fix it for you. This is perfectly OK, and solves this problem with CZs.