Disappointed in reloading handbook

[FantomKnight]

Oh yeah-- you'll have to be careful with the CZs. They are designed (chambered) specifically for the 124 gr. NATO FMJ round, and the more you deviate from that profile, the more careful you need to be. My 124 gr. cast lead loads are a good .100" shorter than the book length, so they'll not jam in the lands of my CZ Tactical Sport. So case capacity is well below what the books suggest, and therefore pressures are higher. And my charge weight is well under book max. They're so short folks comment on how funny they look. But they run in all my 9s, so I don't have to produce different loads for different guns. Thank goodness.

Lots o' stuff to learn. Fun, if you're a science nerd like me.

Oh, BTW, there are gunsmiths out there that will ream your CZ barrel to fit whatever bullet you want. You send 'em the barrel, a dummy cartridge, and like $30, and they'll fix it for you. This is perfectly OK, and solves this problem with CZs.

I am a science nerd. It's one of the reasons I think I'll like reloading. I like experimenting. I just wish I lived some place where I could shoot in my back yard. I'm going to have to load these rounds and take them to the range and test them out. That'll be kind of a drag. I haven't gotten my caliper yet to check factory round COAL, but I've not had any problems with anything that I've shot through my CZs. Just did the plunk test on a couple of different factory rounds, and didn't have any problem rotating the round in the chamber. Do factory rounds typically have shorter COAL than you would normally have when reloading?

 

[jeep78]

With cast bullets, barrels that have throated chambers (rifling area, not ramp area) tend to work better. Some manufacturers di this from the factory

I am a science nerd. It's one of the reasons I think I'll like reloading. I like experimenting. I just wish I lived some place where I could shoot in my back yard. I'm going to have to load these rounds and take them to the range and test them out. That'll be kind of a drag. I haven't gotten my caliper yet to check factory round COAL, but I've not had any problems with anything that I've shot through my CZs. Just did the plunk test on a couple of different factory rounds, and didn't have any problem rotating the round in the chamber. Do factory rounds typically have shorter COAL than you would normally have when reloading?

It isn't so much the COL as it is the bullet profile. Many cast bullets are wider, closer to the nose than the FMJ, and will engage the lands, where the FMJ won't.

This is the case with an original milspec 1911 barrel. Throating the barrel fixes it by "moving" the lands further away from the chamber, allowing different shape bullets to fully load without touching the lands.

 

[insulinboy]

Oh I'm not giving up. That's why I came to ask the experts. And, yes, on Hodgdon's site, I found more than 20 promising loads for 124gr round nose. Thanks to those that pointed me there, and Alliant's site as well. I still would like to have data in handbooks though. I won't be at my computer while reloading. The computer would be on a different floor. Of course, I could just print out stuff from powder manufacturer's sites. However, I don't think that I would trust anything not from a powder, bullet, or reloading machinery manufacturer. It's too easy for idiots to post just anything on the Internet.

I actually keep a cheap $50 walmart tablet at my bench and have a wifi range extender so I have internet in the garage. Have print outs of what I use the most as well as a notebook with records of loads I get the best accuracy with

 

[insulinboy]

I am a science nerd. It's one of the reasons I think I'll like reloading. I like experimenting. I just wish I lived some place where I could shoot in my back yard. I'm going to have to load these rounds and take them to the range and test them out. That'll be kind of a drag. I haven't gotten my caliper yet to check factory round COAL, but I've not had any problems with anything that I've shot through my CZs. Just did the plunk test on a couple of different factory rounds, and didn't have any problem rotating the round in the chamber. Do factory rounds typically have shorter COAL than you would normally have when reloading?

I shouls really read a whole thread before posting lol.

CoL is different for different guns sone times. My xd needed a max col of 1.6 for the rounds to even funtion properly in the mag without sticking, my 1911 and sigs cam stretch the whole 1.7 and be fine in the mag. The 1911 likes the 1.7 col (and doesnt quite touch the lands) but the sig maxes out at 1.65 before it comes in contact. (Loading 9mm in all guns specified) the closer you can get the bullet to the lands without actually engaging them, the better the groups. And its only really a marginal improvement in a handgun (its much more noticable when streatching out a rifle where mm at the barrel ends up being inches at the target), but when shooting competition (which ia where the fun in reloading relly comes in) every little bit helps

 

[kuduman]

Do factory rounds typically have shorter COAL than you would normally have when reloading?

I do not know, though some others have chimed in that are knowledgeable than me. It's possible that the answer is "yes", because those guys test their ammo presumably in a lot of different guns-- and probably have a "difficult" batch of guns they use for that.

You do need calipers. Even a cheap pair is way better than none at all.

With revolver bullets, OAL is easy-- you seat until the edge of the case is at the top of the crimp groove. And crimp there. You're done. that works 99% of the time. Not so simple with auto cartridges.

I'm glad to hear that your CZs aren't sticking with commercial ammo. My TS does, with some commercial JHP. But it's irrelevant; it's a competition gun only. It may have a tighter chamber/lead whatever than the "carry CZs" do, for that reason. Glad to hear that not all CZs are that tight.

 

[fotog54]

Been reloading off an on for about 25 years. Never owned a chronograph. Only because I never had a place to shoot. I haven't blown up anything yet. I stick to middle range loads that I find in the powder manufacturer's website and make sure they cycle well in all of my guns. And I have a couple of manuals. I also consider the Lee reloading the best because it had the most information for me. I only load 9mm and 45ACP. And like all the others have said "keep good notes!". Learn the forums you can get good information from. Handgun reloading I usually search Enos forums, a lot of competitive shooters there.

 

[Flashover16]

The only real problem that I have ran into with my CZ's (P-01, Sp-01, 97BD ) was with flat point plated projectiles. the taper to the tip varies a good bit between the Extreme, the Berrys and the Rainier.
so all three need a different OAL, thats why I stick to one brand.
all the Hp, FMJ that I have tried in the weapons have funtioned just fine with the standard listed OAL from the manual.
I have ran 80-85-90-100-115-124-147 grain through the weapons.
175-185-200-230 grain through the 97BD.
and yes OAL will vary form factory ammo to other factory ammo.
lots of times its the different make up of the projectile (It may be longer/shorter depending on how much lead is in it) , other times its the powder they use in the particular ammo.

 

[gh1950]

If you want some real fun, buy some older manuals (before about 1990).

Their are a lot of them around, you just have to look for them. Ebay, flea markets, dare i say it, gun shows. Loading manuals do not go out of date.

What you will find is that the loads for a lot of common calibers have been downrated, .38 spec., 9mm. 10mm, .40 S&W, .44 mag., among others (not to even speak about rifle calibers).

As far as current manuals, you have to look for what the publisher sells. I find that the broadest bullet selection is in manuals by powder manufacturers. Although the loads are slanted toward their powders, there are enough similar powders that you can build your own load.

Lyman does not make powders, nor does it make bullets, thus you wouldn't expect it to have an expansive list of either. It still is probably the best printed reference for the beginning reloader.

If you want to see a more comprehensive reloading manual, look at the Lyman Shotshell manual.

 

[FantomKnight]

OK, this is more like it. I went onto ebay and found The Complete Reloading Manual for the 9mm Luger. It's essentially a compilation of load data from various bullet and powder manufacturer websites, all bound together in one book. The one that I got has recipes for 68 various 9mm bullet designs and 42 different powders. Of course, I will definitely cross reference any of these recipes with other sources before actually using them. But, even though this book is only 53 pages (and some of that is ads), it gives me much more load data than the Lyman 50th.

 

[SouthernCoyote]

Some manufacturers list data on their websites, but sometimes I haven't been able to find things on their sites either. In my experience so far, if I can't find something specific, I've had good luck emailing the manufacturer and tell them what I need info on and they will send load data for it. When I started reloading with Berger Bullets, I couldn't find a whole lot that really gave me what I needed, so I emailed them, and a lil while later, I had an email with load data for COAL and starting loads and max loads with case pressures with tons of different powders.