Full Length Size wouldn't chamber (a first for me)

[flyingfrog509]

SHORT ANSWER/MY SOLUTION: Cut 15 thou off the top of a shell holder so now the die touches and sizes the brass to fit my chamber.

LONG STORY:
Just built a Solus action w/6.5PRC shouldered prefit Origin barrel...easy peasy right? I like to keep the shoulder at about 2 thou off the chamber to reduce the case being worked more than it needs to be because often taking a FL die and touching or touching + 1/8 of a turn will fit almost any gun but might work your brass more than it needs to. So I back the FL die usually 1 turn off the shell holder, take the decapping/sizing mandrel out of the die, take the plungers out of the bolt, take a long once fired case and rejoice when it gives resistance before the bolt falls...then gradually move the FL die down until the bolt falls under its own weight when chambering the brass. I've found that to usually be about 2 thou. UNTIL last night. RCBS dies & shell holders even touching + 1/4 turn would still leave the bolt barely going down 1/4 of the way before it was obvious I was sizing the brass in the gun. I thought oh crap I didn't check over all case length, nope wasn't that. I thought maybe the neck was to thick, nope wasn't that. I thought maybe it was my die, tried two others a RCBS body die & a master hunting set and all three had the exact same problem...the brass was slightly to long for my chamber. (YES, I checked go/no-go when assembling the barrel) That left me with the shell holder as the possible problem. So to test before going all crazy on my shell holder (because typically I have a single "master set" of shell holders used across multiple die sets) I took my feeler gauge and put it under the case between the base of the shell holder and the base of the brass and resized it that way. (thought it was a great way to bend my feeler gauges but it didn't) Long story short it took .020 under the case before the resized case would fit in the chamber and let the bolt fall. I was amazed until I went digging thru my parts bin and found two more shell holders and noticed that they were all just slightly different in the height between what touches the ram and the bottom of the base. Some were off by as much as 4-6 thou between Lee and RCBS holders. So after a sanity check of going an buying some factory ammo (that fit w/no problem) and taking more measurements off that I ended up taking a new shell holder and taking the amount I needed off the top so the FL size die will size brass to fit my chamber. Now with that "shaved" shell holder all 3 of the 6.5PRC dies size the brass exactly the same and they all fit. I marked that shell holder and keep a note in each box to use that specific shell holder.

NEVER had that happen before and I've been reloading for almost 20 years now. Not saying I'm some guru reloader but I've got a drawer full of dies of all sorts of calibers from over the years and this was a first for me.

Has anyone else ever had a FL die not resize brass to fit in a chamber like that? Am I crazy? (ok that's just an invitation to getting my chops busted but I'm really curious)

 

[1006]

The shell holders are matched to fit the same brand Die as the shell holder. Mixxing and matching can cause issues.

 

[rosewood]

Well, a full length size doesn't. There is always that part at the base where the die didn't resize. In high pressure loads and in a loose chamber, a case may expand where the die doesn't resize it. This is especially prevalent in belted magnum cases and someone has made a collet type tool for fixing that. In the 40 S&W for example, many times they have the "bulge" caused by unsupported chambers and Lee developed the bulge buster kit which works on all of their straight walled (non-tapered) rimless cases. It will iron out those parts of the case that a FL die won't reach. The Lee bulge buster kit uses the LEE FCD with the guts removed to push the case completely through the die. I have found I can use the bulge buster kit with the Lee Factory Crimp Die for a .380 to remove the bulge on .223s. Small base die isn't necessary and undersizes the case. I haven't tried other rifle cartridges, but you would need to find a straight wall pistol die that matches the dimension of the rifle case in question.

You have me wondering now, a 45 acp FCD may work on a .308 sized case. I will have to do some measuring to see if it would work.

The bulge buster just knocks off the bulge at the base, a case still needs to be sized by standard sizing die for that cartridge.

I run all of my 40, 10mm, 357sig and 9x25 dillon through the 40 bulge buster to iron out the base of those cases.

Rosewood

 

[flyingfrog509]

Well, a full length size doesn't. There is always that part at the base where the die didn't resize. In high pressure loads and in a loose chamber, a case may expand where the die doesn't resize it. This is especially prevalent in belted magnum cases and someone has made a collet type tool for fixing that. In the 40 S&W for example, many times they have the "bulge" caused by unsupported chambers and Lee developed the bulge buster kit which works on all of their straight walled (non-tapered) rimless cases. It will iron out those parts of the case that a FL die won't reach. The Lee bulge buster kit uses the LEE FCD with the guts removed to push the case completely through the die. I have found I can use the bulge buster kit with the Lee Factory Crimp Die for a .380 to remove the bulge on .223s. Small base die isn't necessary and undersizes the case. I haven't tried other rifle cartridges, but you would need to find a straight wall pistol die that matches the dimension of the rifle case in question.

You have me wondering now, a 45 acp FCD may work on a .308 sized case. I will have to do some measuring to see if it would work.

The bulge buster just knocks off the bulge at the base, a case still needs to be sized by standard sizing die for that cartridge.

I run all of my 40, 10mm, 357sig and 9x25 dillon through the 40 bulge buster to iron out the base of those cases.

Rosewood

For those w/WIN MAG cases with the base bulged there is Belted Magnum Collet Resizing Die they work great.

In my case it was the shoulder that wasn't getting bumped enough even with the die touching the shell holder. One of the guys pointed out I was mixing & matching RCBS & LEE. Originally I was using a lee shell holder with RCBS dies, but then even the RCBS shell holder didn't fit until I shaved the face down a few thou. The base wasn't an issue with the once fired brass I was working with. Measured that against my virgin ADG brass. It was driving me nuts, but got it solved. Just seemed wrong to do it that way.

Good to know on the bulge buster dies, hadn't heard of that before. Glocks are horrible about bulging brass too. Will be checking that out before long.

 

[rosewood]

Good to know on the bulge buster dies, hadn't heard of that before. Glocks are horrible about bulging brass too. Will be checking that out before long.

I believe Glock is the reason they invented it.

For the Belted Mag cases, I bought a Lee set for 7mm STW on clearance at BPS for $10. I cut the top off the sizing die and then milled a few thou off the base so it will size all the way to the belt. It has worked great for those cases that are bulged and won't chamber. Usually ones fired in another gun and don't have to do it again in the same gun.

Rosewood

 

[Jackie Graham]

You might want to get a comparator gauge. You can check what actually fits in your chamber and make a note of the length. Then each time you setup your dies you can make sure that the results are the same.
I use them on 223s, 300BO and 308.

AltitudeCraft: Bullet and Headspace Comparator

The AltitudeCraft bullet comparator kit is the reloader's dream, ensuring unparalleled precision in measuring the seating depth of loaded ammunition.

aax-us-iad.amazon.com

 

[Jackie Graham]

Sheridan also makes a case gauge that works well.

 

[rosewood]

You might want to get a comparator gauge. You can check what actually fits in your chamber and make a note of the length. Then each time you setup your dies you can make sure that the results are the same.
I use them on 223s, 300BO and 308.

I bought one of the comparator setups and found it works well on my 9x25 dillon cases so I don't overwork them, and maintain correct headspace. Works well on most bottle necked cases.

Rosewood

 

[Jackie Graham]

They are great to have. Without a gauge you are just guessing on the actual head space. You will also find that OEM ammo can vary by a few thousands.

 

[Jeremy braddy]

SHORT ANSWER/MY SOLUTION: Cut 15 thou off the top of a shell holder so now the die touches and sizes the brass to fit my chamber.

LONG STORY:
Just built a Solus action w/6.5PRC shouldered prefit Origin barrel...easy peasy right? I like to keep the shoulder at about 2 thou off the chamber to reduce the case being worked more than it needs to be because often taking a FL die and touching or touching + 1/8 of a turn will fit almost any gun but might work your brass more than it needs to. So I back the FL die usually 1 turn off the shell holder, take the decapping/sizing mandrel out of the die, take the plungers out of the bolt, take a long once fired case and rejoice when it gives resistance before the bolt falls...then gradually move the FL die down until the bolt falls under its own weight when chambering the brass. I've found that to usually be about 2 thou. UNTIL last night. RCBS dies & shell holders even touching + 1/4 turn would still leave the bolt barely going down 1/4 of the way before it was obvious I was sizing the brass in the gun. I thought oh crap I didn't check over all case length, nope wasn't that. I thought maybe the neck was to thick, nope wasn't that. I thought maybe it was my die, tried two others a RCBS body die & a master hunting set and all three had the exact same problem...the brass was slightly to long for my chamber. (YES, I checked go/no-go when assembling the barrel) That left me with the shell holder as the possible problem. So to test before going all crazy on my shell holder (because typically I have a single "master set" of shell holders used across multiple die sets) I took my feeler gauge and put it under the case between the base of the shell holder and the base of the brass and resized it that way. (thought it was a great way to bend my feeler gauges but it didn't) Long story short it took .020 under the case before the resized case would fit in the chamber and let the bolt fall. I was amazed until I went digging thru my parts bin and found two more shell holders and noticed that they were all just slightly different in the height between what touches the ram and the bottom of the base. Some were off by as much as 4-6 thou between Lee and RCBS holders. So after a sanity check of going an buying some factory ammo (that fit w/no problem) and taking more measurements off that I ended up taking a new shell holder and taking the amount I needed off the top so the FL size die will size brass to fit my chamber. Now with that "shaved" shell holder all 3 of the 6.5PRC dies size the brass exactly the same and they all fit. I marked that shell holder and keep a note in each box to use that specific shell holder.

NEVER had that happen before and I've been reloading for almost 20 years now. Not saying I'm some guru reloader but I've got a drawer full of dies of all sorts of calibers from over the years and this was a first for me.

Has anyone else ever had a FL die not resize brass to fit in a chamber like that? Am I crazy? (ok that's just an invitation to getting my chops busted but I'm really curious)

I have had plenty of the same issues loading the 6.5 prc, and it’s a shame. It’s my favorite caliber, the brass has to be trimmed more than any caliber I’ve previously shot. I’ve owned 3 different rifles in the prc. And I’ve had the best luck out of federal nickel plated brass with little or no issues, second choice has been nosler brass. Hornady and Norma brass are the two that have been the most unreliable for my press, they shoot fine they just don’t resize well. I’ve had to disassemble my press many times to get a case out. I also switched from a Hornady die, and tried the Rcbs, it works better for me. Good luck!