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Kahr CM45. ---2ND UPDATE: Just not reliable.

Bear44

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I picked up a new Kahr CM45 from Cherokee Gun and Pawn for a great price earlier today and just got back from the range, so he are my first impresions of this pocket sized 45 ACP.

The Good:

1) OK, it might be a little big for a pocket pistol for some folks, but I'm a big guy and wear tactical style cargo pants all the time. It fits in my pocket with no problem and does not print. You can see something is there, but it doesn't look like a gun. In an IWB holster is just disappears. It does not print with just a loose untucked T-Shirt and is light enough to forget it's there.

2) It is surprisingly accurate. I had no problem putting rounds in the same hole at 25ft if I took my time.

3) I'm an old 1911 guy and am completely spoiled by the high quality 1911 triggers I've been shooting for decades. The trigger on this gun is very different, but is no problem at all for me to shoot. It's DAO and has a very long pull, but it is the best trigger I have ever shot on a DAO pistol. It's VERY smooth and has consistent pressure all the way back. There is ZERO stack. You just press that slippery sucker and it goes BOOM. Very nice! The trigger pull is also long enough that I feel confident that it will be safe to pocket carry without a pocket holster.

4) It is very controllable. You would think that a small, lightweight 45 ACP would be a bit rude when firing it, but this is not the case. It is very well designed and I had no problem with rapped fire shooting. Unlike the CM9 and CM40, the grip is long enough for all three of your fingers to be on it. This is made possible because the grip is a tiny bit longer than the other CM pistols and the mag supplied with the gun has a small finger rest on the bottom. It's not very big, just big enough. Good thinking, Kahr. The grip texture is also aggressive enough that there is no slippage during rapid fire.

5) The ergonomics are extremely good. I was surprised to find that the very first time I drew the weapon quickly, the sights lined up perfectly and on target. This was very consistent and effortless. It also fell right back onto target after recoil. That's good news in any weapon, but especially for an EDC.

6) Though Kahr recommends a 200 round break-in, I had no classic FTF or FTE after more than 100 rounds. I shot a couple of different brands of FMJ, Fed Hydro Shock, Gold Dot, Hornady TAP and Pow "R" Ball ammo.



The VERY BAD:

1) The spring on the slide stop is much too weak. Regardless of how I gripped the pistol the slide stop would lock the slide back about 20% of the time during firing. It happened at least once on almost every 5 round mag. NOT acceptable!

2) The firing pin is off center to much. It only failed to fire twice, but you can see in the pic below that when it does fire the pin has to slide across the primer face to hit the anvil within the primer. Even if it never failed to fire this will cause stress on the firing pin and it's going to fail long before it should.

As is, this pistol is not suitable for SD, but it has potential to be a great EDC IF Kahr can fix these two problems. I'll be contacting them on Monday. I guess the rest of this review will be on how good their customer service is.

Kahr.jpg
The E-Cig is there for scale.

primers.jpg
The two on top are the ones that did not fire. The three on the bottom are to show how the firing pin must slide to fire the round. It's possible they are marks from the pin during ejection, but that would mean the two that failed to fire are from a light primer strike. We'll see what Kahr has to say about it..
 
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I picked my new CM45 up Thursday but didn't get it to the range yet. I DID, however own a PM45 at one time and shot it so I know what you are experiencing. I would say that I really don't think you have a recoil spring issue. I would say that you have a wrist issue. Not that you have any limp wrist issues in general but these things are so tight, light and have such minimal margin for error in their cycle that ANY flex in the wrist is prone to absorb enough of the action to allow the slide to lock back.

Similarly I would consider the possibility that your two failure to fires might have been from the slide not being fully in battery. I've had experiences with Kahr 45's both CW45 and PM45 being unable to come fully into battery on 230 grain JHP ammo of some brands. Mag Tech and Hornady come to mind.

One thing I HIGHLY recommend for these guns is a wrap around grip. These little 17.3 ounce (+2 for magazine) 45 ACP's are a bear to shoot much. My PM45 rubbed a hole in my hand the first time I took it to the range. I use a bicycle inner tube to make custom size wrap around grips for all of my pistols now. $5 for 20-25 grips is hard to beat.

Also, did you send in for your free magazine?

http://www.kahr.com/MagPromo2014.asp
 
I picked up a new Kahr CM45 from Cherokee Gun and Pawn for a great price earlier today and just got back from the range, so he are my first impresions of this pocket sized 45 ACP.

The Good:

1) OK, it might be a little big for a pocket pistol for some folks, but I'm a big guy and wear tactical style cargo pants all the time. It fits in my pocket with no problem and does not print. You can see something is there, but it doesn't look like a gun. In an IWB holster is just disappears. It does not print with just a loose untucked T-Shirt and is light enough to forget it's there.

2) It is surprisingly accurate. I had no problem putting rounds in the same hole at 25ft if I took my time.

3) I'm an old 1911 guy and am completely spoiled by the high quality 1911 triggers I've been shooting for decades. The trigger on this gun is very different, but is no problem at all for me to shoot. It's DAO and has a very long pull, but it is the best trigger I have ever shot on a DAO pistol. It's VERY smooth and has consistent pressure all the way back. There is ZERO stack. You just press that slippery sucker and it goes BOOM. Very nice! The trigger pull is also long enough that I feel confident that it will be safe to pocket carry without a pocket holster.

4) It is very controllable. You would think that a small, lightweight 45 ACP would be a bit rude when firing it, but this is not the case. It is very well designed and I had no problem with rapped fire shooting. Unlike the CM9 and CM40, the grip is long enough for all three of your fingers to be on it. This is made possible because the grip is a tiny bit longer than the other CM pistols and the mag supplied with the gun has a small finger rest on the bottom. It's not very big, just big enough. Good thinking, Kahr. The grip texture is also aggressive enough that there is no slippage during rapid fire.

5) The ergonomics are extremely good. I was surprised to find that the very first time I drew the weapon quickly, the sights lined up perfectly and on target. This was very consistent and effortless. It also fell right back onto target after recoil. That's good news in any weapon, but especially for an EDC.

6) Though Kahr recommends a 200 round break-in, I had no classic FTF or FTE after more than 100 rounds. I shot a couple of different brands of FMJ, Fed Hydro Shock, Gold Dot, Hornady TAP and Pow "R" Ball ammo.



The VERY BAD:

1) The spring on the slide stop is much too weak. Regardless of how I gripped the pistol the slide stop would lock the slide back about 20% of the time during firing. It happened at least once on almost every 5 round mag. NOT acceptable!

2) The firing pin is off center to much. It only failed to fire twice, but you can see in the pic below that when it does fire the pin has to slide across the primer face to hit the anvil within the primer. Even if it never failed to fire this will cause stress on the firing pin and it's going to fail long before it should.

As is, this pistol is not suitable for SD, but it has potential to be a great EDC IF Kahr can fix these two problems. I'll be contacting them on Monday. I guess the rest of this review will be on how good their customer service is.

View attachment 312544
The E-Cig is there for scale.

View attachment 312545
The two on top are the ones that did not fire. The three on the bottom are to show how the firing pin must slide to fire the round. It's possible they are marks from the pin during ejection, but that would mean the two that failed to fire are from a light primer strike. We'll see what Kahr has to say about it..

keep us posted. I have a CM9 and it has been flawless. I have been looking at the CM45 now as well as the price you cannot beat . BUT if it has issues than low price means nothing
 
Interesting... I own four Kahrs and have never had those probs... BUT three of mine are 9mm and one is 380
hope they get it worked out... Have heard they have good CS
 
I picked my new CM45 up Thursday but didn't get it to the range yet. I DID, however own a PM45 at one time and shot it so I know what you are experiencing. I would say that I really don't think you have a recoil spring issue. I would say that you have a wrist issue. Not that you have any limp wrist issues in general but these things are so tight, light and have such minimal margin for error in their cycle that ANY flex in the wrist is prone to absorb enough of the action to allow the slide to lock back.

Similarly I would consider the possibility that your two failure to fires might have been from the slide not being fully in battery. I've had experiences with Kahr 45's both CW45 and PM45 being unable to come fully into battery on 230 grain JHP ammo of some brands. Mag Tech and Hornady come to mind.

One thing I HIGHLY recommend for these guns is a wrap around grip. These little 17.3 ounce (+2 for magazine) 45 ACP's are a bear to shoot much. My PM45 rubbed a hole in my hand the first time I took it to the range. I use a bicycle inner tube to make custom size wrap around grips for all of my pistols now. $5 for 20-25 grips is hard to beat.

Also, did you send in for your free magazine?

http://www.kahr.com/MagPromo2014.asp

WOW! Thanks for the info on the free mags!

I can say with confidence it's not from limp wristing. I thought of that and had an iron grip on it several times it happened. Also, the typical problem from limp wristing is a FTF or FTE. This was a situation where the slide stop was actually engaging the slide. It's not the recoil spring that's too weak. It's the slide stop spring itself. If you shake the pistol with the slide in battery you can see the slide stop moving up and down a little. You may have a point about it not being in full battery on the light primer strikes and that would come under the break-in process. However, I'm still uncomfortable with how off center the pin strike is and the drag mark showing up on the primers that do fire. That can't be good for the firing pin. Hopefully it will turn out to be nothing and the next time it fails to fire I'll closely check if it's all the way into battery. I'll also keep a close eye on the condition of the pin to see if it is getting damaged. If the firing pin turns out not to be a problem the only thing that needs fixing is the slide stop spring. I may have just gotten a bad one.
 
OK. Gotcha on the slide stop spring. I haven't had any problems with mine just in the little bit of hand wracking I've done with it. But I did have a devil of a time getting the round I had chambered to eject. The extractor pulled it and the ejector started flipping it but it wedged in the chamber and I couldn't get the slide all the way to the slide lock position. Damn things have so little tolerance and over-travel. And they are so tight. A long time ago someone suggested locking the slide back and leaving it like that for a week or so to help break in a recoil spring on a tight gun. I wish I had done that with this until I can get to shoot it.

Actually I'll try to shoot mine tomorrow(working but might be able to get a few shots off). I'll check primers for traces like yours and see if mine's similar or different.

Oh. and gladly. One drawback on the CM's is only one mag. Nice to get a $40 freebie. ;)
 
OK. Gotcha on the slide stop spring. I haven't had any problems with mine just in the little bit of hand wracking I've done with it. But I did have a devil of a time getting the round I had chambered to eject. The extractor pulled it and the ejector started flipping it but it wedged in the chamber and I couldn't get the slide all the way to the slide lock position. Damn things have so little tolerance and over-travel. And they are so tight. A long time ago someone suggested locking the slide back and leaving it like that for a week or so to help break in a recoil spring on a tight gun. I wish I had done that with this until I can get to shoot it.

Actually I'll try to shoot mine tomorrow(working but might be able to get a few shots off). I'll check primers for traces like yours and see if mine's similar or different.

Oh. and gladly. One drawback on the CM's is only one mag. Nice to get a $40 freebie. ;)

Do you know if the CW 45 mags are compatible with the CM 45? I know it's longer, but I will typically carry higher capacity mags for back ups even if they extend below the grip.

I have discovered that a standard 1911 mag fits and functions, but won't lock the slide back after the last round. Good to know.
 
Yes. ALL Kahr 45 mags will work. I have two of these:

7 Round 45 ACP W/ Grip Extension K725G

7 Round 45 ACP W/ Grip Extension "K725G"
7 rounds, .45 ACP, stainless steel with extended grip. Fits P45, CW45 and PM45 only.

Qty: $44.00

for backups.

They haven't updated the "Fits" list...everything that fits a PM, fits a CM.
 
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