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Lady Wants To Buy Pistol For Husband. Is that legal?
- Thread starter Barbwire
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- Jan 7, 2013
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does she want the gun for him or just a couple of supersonic projectiles?
So if I am perfectly legal, and I buy a gun for someone else who is perfectly legal, yet I buy and then resell to him, its an illegal "straw purchase"?
I bet this happens all the time.
"Hey Bob, I am out-of-town for 2 weeks and Academy always has that great Black Friday sale, so pick me up one of those ___________ we were talking about and I'll get you the money for it when I get back in town the end of the month".
Is this what we are talking about??
I bet this happens all the time.
"Hey Bob, I am out-of-town for 2 weeks and Academy always has that great Black Friday sale, so pick me up one of those ___________ we were talking about and I'll get you the money for it when I get back in town the end of the month".
Is this what we are talking about??
Masterful.
Which explains why you don't have a clue about the holding in Abramski.
It has footnotes longer than my post.
It's what some of us are talking about. Others of us are spewing drivel picked up on the internet.
It' not illegal.
Lying on Form 4473 is illegal.
Technically, the ultimate purchaser should advance the money the transaction to be "straw purchase".
Yes, that's basically the same fact pattern as Abramski.
Abramski's uncle wanted a great deal on a Glock pistol.
Abramski could get the gun at a LEO discount using his old police ID.
Abramski's uncle was LEGAL to buy the gun directly, himself, but he would have to pay the normal retail price, not the cop price.
Abramski bought the gun for his uncle, and the uncle immediately reimbursed him.
THE SUPREME COURT HELD:
Everything about this was a straw purchase. Abramski was the "straw" buyer but the uncle was the actual buyer who sent Abramski on this errand for him.
The uncle thus avoided the federally-mandated background check and paperwork that is required to buy guns from FFL dealers.
The uncle wasn't charged, however, because although the INTENT was to make what he did illegal (send his nephew to buy a gun for him and pretend to be the actual purchaser) the law as written by Congress only applies to making false statements.
Since Uncle wasn't there, Uncle didn't make any "false statements" to the FFL gun shop.
Abramski did the act of lying. So he was the only one prosecuted. Indeed, he's the only one who COULD be prosecuted, because even a "conspiracy" has to have an illegal goal as its objective, and here the object of the "conspiracy" was simply to get Uncle a new Glock for a bargain price.
HOWEVER, the Supreme Court pointed out that ANY misrepresentation about the identity, address, state of residence, etc. of the gun's actual buyer or the straw buyer is illegal. It doesn't just have to be a lie about the one question on the Form 4473 that asks if you're the actual buyer.
BOTTOM LINE:
Straw purchases are always illegal if it involves a gun dealer, an FFL holder.
Straw purchases are not illegal in purely private-party sales. Once a legal (non-straw) sale of a gun takes place, THEN the gun's new owner is free to resell it to an agent who is acting for an undisclosed anonymous buyer. As long as the seller doesn't know (or, I would say, have probable cause to believe) that the anonymous purchaser is unqualified to own a gun, that's just another legal private sale. Congress has chosen not to regulate private party sales the way they've regulated sales from merchants and others engaged in the business of firearms.
https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/13pdf/12-1493_5468.pdf
For example, I don't think there's anything wrong with survivalists / preppers wanting to acquire guns now, while they're legal, but only if they can get them anonymously and unresistered, so they can take them and hide them or bury them off the grid for future Second Amendment militia use.
As long as the preppers buy used guns from private party sellers and DON'T send agents shopping in gun stores for them, that's cool. Legally and even morally, I say.
As long as the preppers buy used guns from private party sellers and DON'T send agents shopping in gun stores for them, that's cool. Legally and even morally, I say.
Damn the ATF and them spilling their drivel on the internet
http://www.dontlie.org/straw_purchasing.cfm
I'll take the ATF's definition over some random internet guy.
Or maybe just go with the standard definition
