let some gentlemen know i was carrying.

[Junior_357]

Good deal, then by all means, keep doing it & get as much training as you can from as many places as possible.

The best schools/ instructors will tell you don't just listen to them but to broaden your knowledge base by going to other credible sources.

And if you don't already, make your buddies go with you... you may have to back each other up one day.

For almost 20 years I drug several of my friends to schools I attended cause I was more afraid of them behind me with a gun than a B.G. with one in front of me!

I hear ya...my buddy (the instructor) is a phenomenal shooter, and a well trained instructor. I spoke with him yesterday, and he's enrolled in a couple of classes to see if he can learn something new or learn how to teach something another way. He's really good...I wish he could get enough clientel to turn instruction into a career...but he's just not there yet.

I sometimes take my buddies with me...but yeah, I'm more scared of some of them behind me than I would be of the guy in front of me. Although there are a couple of my friends that I would hide behind because they can take care of business better than I can because they shoot in competition and therefore are way more practiced than I am!

 

[protective measures]

Well, Junior_357, it sounds like both of you are heading the right direction.
I've been instructing FULL time now for almost 2 years on top of my past training & it's amazing how much you learn working w/ so many different people from different backgrounds every week.
Discussions like this one helps to challenge us to keep learning.

 

[CCW]

Just as Protectivemeasures said. How many Law Enforcement agencys and Military bases have you ever heard of that has or utilizes "draw mirrors" ?

Not sure I have ever heard of a "draw mirror", but we are talking about me, a civilian who is looking to keep his mentality and tactic as refined as he can with what he has. I do know for a fact that a large amount of LEO's will agree that they are taught to practice their draw sequences at home in the mirror. How do you think we develop muscle memory? By practicing. Why do people use mirrors? Because there is someone looking right back at you who is just as fast.

Apparentley I did, I just read where you posted that you constantly practiced drawing in front of your mirror to better your skills.

I do and will as long as I have a mirror. There is a reason that martial arts schools, combats schools and training academies have mirrors. The same reason that applies to gymnasiums, dance academies and ballet schools. If you carry yet don't actively practice your draw skill, you are 2 steps behind any perp who usually has his weapon drawn when he approaches.

Of course it was just a movie, but it is a very good example of training. How many mirror drills do you think Tom Cruise did to perfect the "Briefcase Scene" during his roll in the movie Collateral? And please don't tell me it is just a movie because it wasn't just a camera trick.

By your last 2 posts, it sounds as if you have it figured out. I just hope you are efficient.

 

[CCW]

Ballplayer, here is a direct quote from an instructor on this forum to reassure your doubt.

In reference to mirror drills, I was told to do it in the academy in 1969 by a long time FBI instructor and have been doing it ever since. It does work. You will improve speed, technique and proper grip and stance until it will become a natural habit to you. There is no stricter critique than the one you will impose upon yourself.

Training techniques are only weird or funny to the guy that THINKS he is such an expert that it is beneath him. (Remember the old classroom adage, the only dumb question is the one that wasn't asked--same principal) That is the guy I don't want anywhere around me when the situation turns bad, he is more dangerous to me than the adversary.

Sure, it may look funny or make you chuckle when you think about it but I can tell you that we need every single minute of refinement that we can take in, no matter how comical it may seem in your mind. I prefer to be as ready as possible should I ever need to exhibit my duty to protect myself or family............especially my family. You can never have too much training and mirror drills are a great "at home" training tool. Will these drills make me a world class dueling bandit or crime stopping Vince? Probably not, but it will sure give me a definite edge over someone who doesn't.

 

[Bear44]

The fact that I used the word retreat does not literally mean run when you can't.
If I were backed into a position between and open door and the car body,obviously, I couldn't run but I can retreat verbally i.e. " Guys,you,ve made a mistake,I just came out of the store but if it makes you feel better I'll apologize anyway.I don't want any trouble."At the same time , I would be watching closely that neither got close enough to kick the door into me and trap me in there.
Yes, they were looking for a victim..and this one luckily worked out because you probably just encounterd a couple of amateur street punks.
If it had been a seasoned criminal or a trained individual, I could see a real possibility of a very different ending.
At that close range, were I intent on accosting you, when you raised your shirt and I saw the weapon, I would have immediately charged into you before you could have gotten it out of the holster and had just a good a chance of getting it in my hand as you would have of getting it in yours.
It is also possible, though somewhat less likely that seeing the gun that close , an amateur may have panicked and charged you as well.
Believe me, in either case, you don't want to be in a struggle for possession of the firearm.
Before I get hit here with 50 ...I would's from the baddest in the valley..Let me just say my responses are based on over 30 years as a LEO and over 20 of that as a certified police instrutor in just about any facet of the job including firearms training,not from what I just think or what my buddies and I decided over a couple beers or what I read in a Captain Marvel Comic Book.
As far as open carry..if that's what you like, it's legal fine..just a word to the wise.
I am a trained individual as are many pro bad guys..yep, they train and work out hyertheticals and practice with their weapons just like you do.
If a pro has a plan and commits to it,lets say rob the bank, he is not going to walk in the door with his weapon out, he will walk in like a customer and look it over and if he sees you carrying, he's just as likely to walk right up behind you and if you're lucky just disarm you so he has two weapons or if your're not lucky and he's "cranked up" just kill you before you ever know whats going on.
I carry all the time and I see the open carrys all the time , yes,in Kroger and Walmart..I do not feel threatened by it (other than you don't know how proficient the carrier is) it doesn't bother me, the open carrier with good common sense is very unlikely to be a threat to an ordinary citizen. Any time I have dropped an opinon on any topic in these forums, I'm just trying to get you to take things in perspective and think.
If some of the posters on ODT really believe some of the things they post(not necessarily in this thread) and would actually act the way they claim, they need to post their preferred brands of cigarettes to be mailed to them or their preferred kinds of flowers for the ceremony because it is just a matter of time and I'm not posting sarcasm..I'm serious.
And to those who like to post the I'll just kill 'em kinds of statements..if you ever become involved in a shooting situation and the prosecutor learns that you post on firearms related forums ,they'll pull your posts and use your own words against you to show "a state of mind for the propensity to commit an illegal act of violence", "a pattern of conduct of making statements that could be construed as threats or manifestations of intent to seek an opportunity to use a firearm against another". Try I was just posting sarcasm as a legal defense and see how well that dog hunts.
I'm not going to enter a debate about the 1stAmend.,I don't have to, I've defended it all my life ..but with it comes responsibility and if you make irresponsibile statements, they can and will be used against you, I've seen it done many times and noI didn't write the cases down just like you don't write down every aspect of your occupation.
When you get on a forum and talk about what a bada**, you are the only person you are impressing or harming is yourself.
Nothing you put in writing, especially on a computer is private.
I'm not going to enter pointless debates about what cops or prosecutors should do vs what they actually do.
I know what they do,I know why they do it and I know how they do it, most are great well intentioned people, some aren't fit to hold the office but that is true with any occupation in the land.
When you carry and use a firearm you aren't playing an xbox game, it can't be reset or started over, once that trigger is pulled, there's no turning back.

Great post from someone that knows! If you can deescalate a situation through talk, do it. However, in this situation, the OP tried and they had no interest in conversation. They just yelled him down.

 

[jloneill17]

I read about the first 5 pages of posts and I do see everyones opinion. These guys looked like they were looking for a fight. As far as flashing the firearm, if they were a good 10 yards away from me, and cursing and threatening me, no big deal. i get in the car and drive off. BUT if they are 5 ft from me, and there's two of them, and they both are cursing and balling up there fists (which to me means they are getting ready at any second to take a swing) AND they are threatening to "F" me up or beat my a$$, sorry but I'd probably do more than just show it to them. I'd pull it out of the holster and point it at them. Some are gonna say that's wrong or against the law, but whatever. Me and my wife were jumped by a group of men and women in duluth about 4 years ago, and having 3 guys hold me down on the concrete while one stradles my chest and chokes me and punches me in the face is something I'm not gonna experience ever again. all the while i look over and the women are kicking my wife (girlfriend at the time) in the stomach and head on the ground. I'm never looking to fight and I pray to god that I would never have to shoot someone in self defense, but balled up fists from a couple of feet away threatening me will get a gun put in your face. i'm sure are going to agree and some are gonna say that I would go to jail. But I can always get bailed out of jail. I might not make it out of the hospital, or if i do i could have brain damage or something i can't recover from. someone punches you in a parking lot and you fall down and smack your head on the concrete, that could cause some serious health problems then and down the road.

I think the OP was in his right to "even the playing field". He felt that they were going to cause him bodily harm. And I would have to.

 

[Bear44]

I see nothing wrong with letting your adversary know you have means to protect yourself and are willing to do what it takes. The USA government displays its weapons to the world for such reason as does Russia, Japan, England and many others. Practice drawing in front of a mirror I'm not to sure about that method of training vs. real life situations and it reminds me of Barney Fife drawing to a mirror when people speak of doing such.

Training in front of a mirror is a very valid way to get good technique. It's one thing to know what the technique looks like and another knowing you are actually doing it right. You will see mirrors in almost all martial arts training schools for this very purpose and proper use of a firearm in a defensive situation is absolutely a martial art. For every minute I sped in live fire, I spend about five or ten doing drills at home. A good part of this is in front of a mirror to perfect form.

 

[Bear44]

With an experienced Qualified, Certified Instructor who can instruct you in how to build your fundamental skills using proven efficient techniques... and I don't just mean my school. There are plenty of other good ones out there.

Too many people spend all their time looking at their "tools" when they should be learning how to get the job done.
We're covered up with people in our school, including men that have never even shot a gun, who will be more mentally as well as physically trained to use the gun (if they have no other choice) than many that are self-taught who have not invested the time & money to seek out professional help somewhere.

It's only you & your families live's at stake... if you carry a gun for self-defense, GO SOMEWHERE & get some instruction from an expert. No man is born with the skills to use a firearm... you have to be taught like any other skill.
Too many people are too proud to admit that they don't already know everything about guns & tactics.
The best instructors I know are constantly seeking out more training to keep learning & getting better.
If one day you have to use a gun for real, that is no time to "wing" it.
You will have one chance & probably very little time to get it right unless you're real lucky.
And if you're not lucky or don't REALLY know & understand the Use of Deadly Force & Carry laws, at minimum you may go to jail but at worst you or your family could be killed.

This is, of course, true. However, if you don't practice what you have learned it will go away. In fact, until you have drilled it into muscle memory you haven't really learned it and no instructor is going to stand there while you practice your draw 1000 times to ingrain it. Intellectually learn it with a qualified instructor, but then, while it is still fresh in your mind, practice, practice, practice. Also, skills with a firearm are very perishable so you need to keep practicing on a regular basis. Use of a firearm is NOT like riding a bike and if you don't keep your skills sharp you will loose the vast majority of them. Again, practice in a mirror is a very valid training technique.

 

[Bear44]

If everyone on this forum (who hasn't already) would take the time to study Ga's Use of Deadly Force laws, it would save a lot of silly arguments.

^^^^^THIS!!!!^^^^^

 

[Bear44]

Just as Protectivemeasures said. How many Law Enforcement agencys and Military bases have you ever heard of that has or utilizes "draw mirrors" ?

None! That's why most LEO and Military can't shoot worth a damn. Obviously, this a generality. There are those that shoot very well, but those are the ones that take the training well beyond what they are taught at the academy or have additional training as a specialty in the military were they shoot LOTS of live ammo.

I work with LEO that need to qualify. The same ones repeatedly. And qualification for LEO is very easy. They have to keep coming back every time they need to qualify because they don't practice in between qualifications.