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Thinking About a 410 AR for home defense

While my personal choice would not be birdshot, this pattern indicates the shot was fired at greater than "in the house" distances. It also looks like he was fleeing the scene when shot.

Here's a not exactly real world video that one could use in an argument for using birdshot in a shotgun:


Around 9:40 or so he tests #8 in a 12 gauge for self defense to prevent over penetration in drywall.

My preference would still be buckshot, but at 5 yards the birdshot still seems to be pretty damaging. Sufficient for self defense? As he says "You be the judge".

Not necessarily. Most are used to seeing birdshot patterns when fired from our favorite hunting guns with 24”-28” barrels, and rarely an open cylinder choke.

Fire some of your favorite dove loads from a 14”-18” barrel with an open cylinder choke and see how quickly that pattern opens up. At distances found in many residences, it’ll look like the pic I posted above.

A shot in the back ain’t necessarily a “bad” shot from a legal perspective……perps don’t have to be facing you all the time, or even know that you’re there. It’s all based on the totality of the circumstances, and we don’t have nearly enough info to judge this shooting.
 
Dick Cheney shot Harry Whittington, in the head, with birdshot, at a distance that’s well within the constraints of the distances found in a modest dwelling. Whittington was just fine.

My understanding of the incident (and research into it) is that Dick Cheney shot Whittington with a 28 gauge, in right cheek, neck, and chest, at a distance of about 30 yards. Most likely using #8 shot. 3 days later Whittington had an atrial fibrillation, with at least 1 lead pellet in or near his heart and a collapsed lung. Certainly not an incapacitating shot at the time of the incident; however, that 28 gauge at longish range managed to put one into his heart.

http://thesmokinggun.com/file/texas-cops-release-cheney-shooting-report

The Cheney-Whittington incident isn't a good example of bird shot not being effective for self defense. You certainly have more "real world" experience than I, but Paul Harrell's testing certainly makes it appear heavy bird shot at "inside the house" ranges could be effective while penetrating less through walls. Patterning the shotgun is a must to insure a tight pattern with the load, but one should do that with any shotshell.

My personal choice would still be buck shot - but I'm not concerned about over penetration.
 
Using birdshot for a home def load in a shotgun makes about as much sense as using rat shot for HD in your pistol. Might as well just go with a non lethal taser or CS if you are restricted to that.
 
There is always the Henry Axe .410
G0620-HENRY-1-2-copy.jpg
 
I have the usual home defense weapons, locked and loaded, and ready to be deployed. But, the more I study on how best to defend the home place the question of how to not kill the next door neighbor with pass through pellets, slugs or bullets, comes in to focus.

I have always relied on a pump 12 gauge and a back up pump 20 gauge. I have seen how many sheets of sheetrock the flying pellets or slugs will pass through before they stop and it is impressive and given the walls from one end of my house to the other, the neighbors would be in peril if I unloaded on someone who has breached the doors. This goes extra for the 45 ACP, .38, 9mm, 44 Rem Mag and 22 mag that also serve as backup.

So, given that, I've been thinking of one of the 410 AR, like the ATI or even a home built on a 410 upper and some sort of lower. I just don't know enough about building an AR, even with a 410 upper to consider doing it myself. None of the ATI 410 are available at a reasonable price. Best price I've found is 679 or so on guns.com plus tax and maybe shipping (they might have free shipping right now).

410 with buckshot will pass through several walls so probably looking at loading with 8 or 9 shot as they will do the job and probably not endanger the neighbors.

So, what do you think? AR 410? Crossbow? Keep shopping the pawn shops? Try to find one cheap on gunbroker.com (not likely with the shill bidding going on there). Build it myself and then take it to someone to rebuild, correct, fix what ever I do wrong?

Anyone having one of the 410s that they can speak of and provide some guidance? One of the issues I've seen on you tube is that they have feed issues until you've put about 100 bucks worth of shells through them (something strange about the way the shells stack and the way the magazines are made). I don't have time, extra shells or a place currently to shoot 100 shells just to try and make sure it doesn't fail during a home invasion.

I'm old, have shot for a long time and this is a new avenue for me so any good direction and wise counsel will be greatly appreciated.
Everything I have read about the AR in 410 is they are unreliable.

a pump 12 gauge with a good flashlight firmly attached is better choice. Remember, they call it a scattergun and an alley cleaner. But the reality is the spread is 1 inch per yard traveled. A quick search says 14 inches at 25 feet. So the reality is it’s almost a rifle at very close quarters.
 
You'd be better off with a 12 gauge pump with shells loaded in a less lethal/penetrative to more lethal penetrative gradient, the more critical the situation the more shells you can cycle out to get to the good stuff. I'd trust my life to a .22lr pistol before a .410 shotgun, probably the second most worthless round after .25acp.
 
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