Man oh Man , when I started this thread I never thought it would go this far.....I feel I have created a monster.
I say this has turned into a good thread.
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What caliber do you carry and why?
- Thread starter Gacowboy
- Start date
I say this has turned into a good thread.
I'd stay away from the Montana Gold hollowpoints for carry ammo. They were never designed as self defense ammo and lack poor expansion through various mediums. I've seem some funky stuff when shooting them at various types of targets. My GLOCK 34 has seen I don't know how many thousands of them and loves them. They are very accurate bullets and popular with the competition arena. Just keep in mind what they were designed for when looking at a carry round.
I'm sure if he could have, he would have. And that's where the 45 comes into play. As I've said before, we don't live in a perfect world and reality is always different than what you imagine beforehand. Anyone that has experienced serious stress fire will tell you that your accuracy falls way off in that situation. Take your average day at the range and reduce your proficiency by half at the very least. That takes your nice, tight center mass group and spreads it all over the torso. Peripheral hits with a 45 mean a lot more than with a 9mm. IMHO.
The higher round count of most 9mm is an advantage, but only in an extended encounter. The vast majority of the time a self defense situation is over, one way or the other, RIGHT NOW. The first few rounds (or even the first one) is what determines the outcome. I am typically a logical person and I know there are stats that say a 9mm is so close to a 45 in stopping power that it makes no difference, but I just can't believe that. The 45 just hits harder.
Man oh Man , when I started this thread I never thought it would go this far.....I feel I have created a monster.
Not a monster at all. It's one of the best I've seen. Great and courteous back and forth of differing opinions. Good stuff. Congrats on the thread.
As you say, the capacity only works in an extended encounter.. How can you be sure that the one time in your lifetime that you need to use your firearm isn't going to be an "extended encounter"? Are you sure you are going to deliver all hits on target that are going to drop everyone DRT? You said it yourself, expect your accuracy to be worse. Miss a few shots, maybe get a peripheral hit or two and one that will eventually kill him. If you have 8 rounds in the gun that leaves you with only another shot or two. If you have 16, you've got another half a mag. What would you like to have left?
Going into statistics, how likely is someone going to be in an armed encounter? Of the number of encounters out there, how many have turned into "extended encounters"? What is your hard data showing that one shot is the end game? The fact is most gunfights last the number of rounds in a person's magazine. I for one want as many or more rounds than the other guy, especially if there are more than one. What it boils down to is nobody knows what will happen. Wouldn't you want the capability to solve the most problems possible?
The hardest thing for an individual to overcome is the expectation of what I call the "perfect gunfight." Being gun guys, self-defense gurus, whatever.. we all envision what an ideal gunfight will be like. Seriously think about this: Do you ever envision getting shot? Losing a mag? Having a malfunction? People run in the way? Police trying to stop us? Miss the bad guys completely? Have the gun get tangled up? Etc etc etc. The point is you have to expect that anything can happen. Murphy's law does come into play (I'm especially screwed as my last name is Murphy.) The reason we strive for ultra-reliability is to minimize the chance of a malfunction. We want more bullets just in case. We buy good bullets hoping to maximize the effectiveness of each shot on target. A good holster and concealment options allows us the get the gun out when we need it most. Good training allows you to deal with problems that occur, both with people and equipment. You practice to make sure that your worst day is better than the other guys best. All of these things are done to prevent a worst case scenario, but in the end we have no control over what will happen. You've got to do the best you can with what you've got. I for one want every little advantage I can get. That is why I have a gun that reliable and holds a lot of bullets, buy good ammo, have good equipment and train/practice with what I have.
+1
I don't enjoy long range sessions with my G27.
One of the reasons that I just purchased a G17 was to have something at the range that I enjoyed shooting while still basically being the same manual of arms, trigger pull, etc. as my EDC.
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All very good points. It comes down to a trade off. I believe the likelihood is that the encounter will be determined by the first few rounds. So I want those rounds to be the most effective. Also, I think that using a round that is less effective increases the likelihood of an extended encounter. It's kind of a self fulfilling prophesy. I admit I have absolutely no evidence to back this up. It's just what I believe. What I would really like to find is some data about self defense encounters that gives details about weapons used (caliber and type), rounds fired and results. Who knows, it could change my mind.
Been there, done that. Probably worse than shooting a S&W 386PD...probably up there with shooting a S&W 360PD. High-pressure rounds like .40/.357 are no fun in light little guns. 38+P isn't much fun out of a gun that weighs less than a pound for that matter.
Heck, .380 is no fun in a gun that weighs 10 ounces....lol.
