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Why Most Guys Never Kill A Big One

There is no such thing as culling for genetics in a free range herd. It is impossible, and it has never been proven. In fact they can't even do it in high fence areas in TX, the place where this myth generated, which is why they have to have these so-called deer culls every few years. I mean really this is so simple, I can't even believe you guys are saying this. Once again bucks travel for miles during the rut, and if you think only the alpha and/or beta bucks are doing the mating in a core area - well that is just funny. And also how in the world does one cull a doe (which is 1/2 the genetic makeup) for bad genetics??? I mean really how are we even discussing this??? But I will say this, if you truly have found a way to trick mother nature, please send me over your business plan because I am going to sell everything I own to invest in you. :laugh:

And btw don't just take my word for it...

"If there is any place in North America where deer managers could make an improvement in antler quality through culling, and simultaneously document the results scientifically, it is on the King Ranch in South Texas. On the 825,000-acre King Ranch, goals and methods exceed QDM intensity and extend into a higher range, Trophy Deer Management (TDM). About eight years ago, Mickey and his research partners at the Caesar Kleberg Wildlife Research Institute and the Texas Parks & Wildlife Department set out to examine culling in a well-documented, scientific study. They are currently analyzing the eighth and final year of data in the study. Mickey summarized the results:

“Over eight years of very intensive culling, we weren’t able to show any benefits in terms of improvement in antler quality.”





I am a meat hunter also. In fact until this year, I had never shot a large buck and very few smaller bucks. I have always let bucks walk and just take a couple of does. So I do not have a dog in this fight other than to correct this complete falsehood so newbie hunters are not in the woods actually thinking they can grow every buck into a monster.


excellent read!!! i agree that you cant look at a smaller buck and say "he aint getting any bigger" so lets take him. no way to control genetics on free roam. if you want larger racks and more bucks look towards your food sources. put in time if you can and install food plots, or lay the yellow acorns to em in the off season. corn is cheap, from feb-aug put a 8$ bag a week around your hunting area. stop with it around mid august that way there is time for them to get it all out of the area. by doing so you've probably recruited twice the deer you had in this area, and the does will stick around since the area has become normal to them. ive always lived by the more does you got, the more bucks will stay in the area, and the more traveling bucks will come in. i try not to hunt so much up until the rut for these spots i have "managed" as the time leading up to the rut is cruetial to the bucks getting ready for rut. you come in stinking the place up and making alot of noise, they will just keep on moving. so with my experience, dont hunt these spots until the rut is in full swing. hunt elseware until then, and im sure that you will be amazed at the # of deer and quality of deer you see.

im not wealthy and dont have the time to buy big acreage and manage herds, but i can spend minimal $ on what i do have, and have "Pick" of the litter when it comes to it.
 
Getting back to the OP, He has a point just did not put it very eloquently and came off confrontational....

His point....if you shoot the little ones you will have no big ones...And that fact is true..

And no you can not manipulate genetics unless you are a Genetic engineer ,but you can manipulate the age structure of the herd.. It take the avg white tail 4.5 to 5.5 years to become fully mature.

As far as harvesting "cull" the avg hunter is just not equipt to make that decision most can't even look at deer and tell you how old he is on the hoof once they are beyond 2.5..


 
There is no such thing as culling for genetics in a free range herd....
A simple fact. I didn't have the energy to address it and just shook my head and moved on. Thanks for having the energy. Some folks simply will not be educated on the matter. If anyone would have a vested interest in spreading this fallacy, you'd think it would be the QDMA. But alas... http://www.qdma.com/corporate/mis-management-bucks
The ONLY reason I can think of to 'cull' a free ranging deer, is one that appears to be sick (not that most people could tell) or mortally wounded.
 
A simple fact. I didn't have the energy to address it and just shook my head and moved on. Thanks for having the energy. Some folks simply will not be educated on the matter. If anyone would have a vested interest in spreading this fallacy, you'd think it would be the QDMA. But alas... http://www.qdma.com/corporate/mis-management-bucks
The ONLY reason I can think of to 'cull' a free ranging deer, is one that appears to be sick (not that most people could tell) or mortally wounded.

Well my main motivation is I think we have it pretty good in GA as far as deer hunting is concerned. We have a long season, and a good size deer herd. Both of these factors are optimal for getting kids in the woods and making it easier for them to enjoy some success - thus passing on the tradition. Could we use some improvement? Of course, but the last thing I want is for mis-education like this to spread which would eventually cause the government to get more involved. And we all know how that always turns out. We need to improve by educating the hunter population.

If you want to go play amateur biologist on your property, then it is your right as long as you follow the hunting regs. But for those who might be considering you will have any success growing antlers by actually culling on genetics, just ask yourself this one simple question. How does one cull a doe based on genetics? And btw I have read some studies that say does might actually play a bigger contributing factor on antler size. Personally I don't know and don't care, but it is also something to consider...

If you want bigger bucks, give them good food and hunt based on age - not antler size, otherwise just enjoy yourself.
 
Getting back to the OP, He has a point just did not put it very eloquently and came off confrontational....

His point....if you shoot the little ones you will have no big ones...And that fact is true..


I didn't get that from this


After watching the hunting section of this and several other forums, I'm re-reminded of why most hunters never kill a large mature buck. If all you want is meat, then do the rest of us a favor and shoot a doe, and whatever you do, stop showing everyone how proud you are of the buck you just killed that just got done suckin' his mama's tit.
 
I didn't get that from this

" whatever you do, stop showing everyone how proud you are of the buck you just killed that just got done suckin' his mama's tit."

he is basically saying don't shoot the small ones or you will have no big ones....reading between the lines a tad but that is what he means.
And it is slightly confrontational in tone.
 
Growing up I worked very hard to manage the deer herd on our farm. Inevitably our neighbors would shoot anything that moved, and it truly wasn't necessary as there were plenty of 140 class deer on up to shoot. They just didn't care about herd management as much as we did, and hey whatever. Yeah it was plenty annoying, but eventually you had to just get over it. I didn't agree with many other choices they made either, but at the end of the day ya gotta just let it go.
 
Growing up I worked very hard to manage the deer herd on our farm. Inevitably our neighbors would shoot anything that moved, and it truly wasn't necessary as there were plenty of 140 class deer on up to shoot. They just didn't care about herd management as much as we did, and hey whatever. Yeah it was plenty annoying, but eventually you had to just get over it. I didn't agree with many other choices they made either, but at the end of the day ya gotta just let it go.
question..... did they know what your management goals were and did you ever try and talk to them about a co-op?
 
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