Why wouldn't you want to do a bill of sale?

[Bucket99]

People are scared when it comes to firearms and don't really know what they need to sell one legally. When I am asked for one I will politely try to explain why they are not legal documents unless they are stamped by a notary and how in the state of Ga. they are not required. I was contacted and questioned by GBI agent on a pistol that I sold years before then and I promise the conversation was short. He did his homework long before he called me and the only questions I got was... Do I own it? Who did I sell it to? When I told him that I sold several years ago at a gunshow to an individual but I did not keep records of who it was but I always ask for a Ga. DL to prove residence. He said thank you for your time and that was the last I ever heard from him.

I have read just about all these threads pertaining to B.O.S. I have a feeling this is how most interactions after the fact would go. They are looking to solve a crime, not falsely accuse you of something. If you use PM's to communicate the deal before meeting, why would you need a piece of paper with someone's personal info that could possibly be lost or stolen?

 

[Georgia Terrapin]

Bill of Sale: "John sells to George on this date one Bersa .380 S/N xxxxxxxx for $250.00 CASH received in full, AS IS NO WARRANTY." /s/

When John sues George for failing to pay, George shows the judge his "received in full" Bill of Sale. Or when six months passes, and George sues John saying the gun doesn't work, John shows the judge his "AS IS NO WARRANTY" copy of the Bill of Sale. No need for a D/L, etc. but that basic information is the same stuff you'd want for buying a couch, a TV, a used car, or anything else of value where there might be a dispute later. It doesn't involve government recordkeeping, it's just personal protection in case something goes wrong with the sale later. Asking to "see" a GWL or other basic info to show it's a legal sale -- such as maybe asking for a signature saying "I'm not legally prohibited from buying this gun," is just prudent.

That's why I prefer a bill of sale, although I didn't ask for or receive one in my last two trades. As someone said, they were well documented in posts and PMs and that's sufficient (if I print the PMs.)

 

[captdave77]

Bill of Sale: "John sells to George on this date one Bersa .380 S/N xxxxxxxx for $250.00 CASH received in full, AS IS NO WARRANTY." /s/

When John sues George for failing to pay, George shows the judge his "received in full" Bill of Sale. Or when six months passes, and George sues John saying the gun doesn't work, John shows the judge his "AS IS NO WARRANTY" copy of the Bill of Sale. No need for a D/L, etc. but that basic information is the same stuff you'd want for buying a couch, a TV, a used car, or anything else of value where there might be a dispute later. It doesn't involve government recordkeeping, it's just personal protection in case something goes wrong with the sale later. Asking to "see" a GWL or other basic info to show it's a legal sale -- such as maybe asking for a signature saying "I'm not legally prohibited from buying this gun," is just prudent.

That's why I prefer a bill of sale, although I didn't ask for or receive one in my last two trades. As someone said, they were well documented in posts and PMs and that's sufficient (if I print the PMs.)

You don't back the guns you sell on this site?

 

[tv_racin_fan]

We'll just have to disagree then. I know I have used it as an identifier on many occasions. Once I was riding by a friend's house that I knew to no be home and there are a truck parked on his lawn. It stroke me a little weird, so I stopped and photographed the rear of the vehicle with the tag and one side of it. As it turned out, it wasn't anything to be alarmed about, it was a roofing contractor looking at the roof and was just out of sight, but it could have been.

I really don't see the need in worrying about a tag number, it is not private information, and about the only way it is going to come up is if an investigator comes asking questions. Whether you agree or not, it is done quite a bit. But, we can agree to disagree.

Luke

I don't understand all the work you do to cover your rear when it could all be covered by simply going thru an FFL dealer and no one on this forum would think anything ill of you. As it is it would seem you have made some ill by your secretive actions.

Such a tangled web need not have been spun.

 

[zesty]

Bill of Sale: "John sells to George on this date one Bersa .380 S/N xxxxxxxx for $250.00 CASH received in full, AS IS NO WARRANTY." /s/

When John sues George for failing to pay, George shows the judge his "received in full" Bill of Sale. Or when six months passes, and George sues John saying the gun doesn't work, John shows the judge his "AS IS NO WARRANTY" copy of the Bill of Sale. No need for a D/L, etc. but that basic information is the same stuff you'd want for buying a couch, a TV, a used car, or anything else of value where there might be a dispute later. It doesn't involve government recordkeeping, it's just personal protection in case something goes wrong with the sale later. Asking to "see" a GWL or other basic info to show it's a legal sale -- such as maybe asking for a signature saying "I'm not legally prohibited from buying this gun," is just prudent.

That's why I prefer a bill of sale, although I didn't ask for or receive one in my last two trades. As someone said, they were well documented in posts and PMs and that's sufficient (if I print the PMs.)

How many times has anyone been sued over a $250 gun? Of those, how many didn't turn out the way they should have? I'll ballpark it at 2 times. ever.

How many congressmen want every gun transfer tracked in a database? How many people are ok with that because "people fill out a BOS or 4473 anyway"? I bet more than the above.

It's not the same as a couch, a TV, or a car. None of those were specifically protected in the Bill of Rights and none of those are under threat.

 

[tv_racin_fan]

With all the info being noted and the book keeping one might wonder if ATF thinks some of the people doing this are trying to be dealers without the correct permission...

 

[Luke]

I don't understand all the work you do to cover your rear when it could all be covered by simply going thru an FFL dealer and no one on this forum would think anything ill of you. As it is it would seem you have made some ill by your secretive actions.

Such a tangled web need not have been spun.

TV,

We've been in this community a long time and as such, I've made a lot of trades. Fortunately, I haven't encountered but a couple of bad experiences, and for all but one of them, I was covered. As I have read through these posts, the thing that bothers me the most is the extent of knowledge that many how on how to negate a BOS and worse the ones that feel that you would or should not honor your contribution to the transaction. Having said that, I really don't care what ill of me that people think, I don't really do any business here anymore anyway.

I will say this, there are a ton of people out there that do the same thing that I do, they just haven't admitted to it.

Luke

 

[rOmiLaYu]

TV,

We've been in this community a long time and as such, I've made a lot of trades.... Having said that...I don't really do any business here anymore anyway.

It would appear you never did much business here to begin with according to your feedback score.

 

[rugerceltics13]

It would appear you never did much business here to begin with according to your feedback score.

guess some members just don't like using itrader system

 

[Luke]

Itrader is not the tell all of trading. People worry about having their name on a BOS but openly display all their transactions on open forum. Then claim that keeping a record of said transactions is running a bsiness. I fail to see the logic there. I will admit thy I have done far less here than I did at GON q.

It would appear you never did much business here to begin with according to your feedback score.

guess some members just don't like using itrader system