I been loading these in 168 and 185 grain bullets and have nothing but great things happen. they shoot as good as any match grade bullet I ever shot. I have loaded the 168s in 308,30-06,300 wsm , if I do my part its just one ragged hole at 100 yards, I have done this with other good bullets, But the Classic Hunters work just like the Berger VLDs , I have not had a deer take another step from the shot, the exit hole are pretty nasty but it kills them like a lightning bolt struck them. I have an exit hole on a 300 pound hog that you could put a softball in, blew off the off side ear and half the head with the 185gr out of my 300 rum. Good luck hunting