I don't know if that would be legal. If you know someone that reloads, you can probably go ask them if you can load a few on their equipment.
.223 55gr FMJ Subs
- Thread starter medium187mph
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I don't know if that would be legal. If you know someone that reloads, you can probably go ask them if you can load a few on their equipment.
Who me?
I'd say "IN" but honestly 10gr of 3N38 seems like it might be dangerous, considering the lack of fill percentage and the fast burning powder... I seen the Titegroup, Trail Boss, and Clay's listed on Hornady's reloading data center under 55gr FMJ's (Kinda odd that it's the only load data it spits out right now for that bullet even when you select all powder manufacturers) If I may ask, where are you coming up with these other numbers?
Hello. I will write an article on this, for natoreloading.com I would say in general, the reloading community is very conservative in how they do things, and what they load. I would say around 90% or maybe more, of reloaders will not even consider loading even .1 grains more than some book says. Or if there is no load data, they will not even touch it. Me on the other hand, don't care at all about load data, I make my own. For example. If somebody gave me some mystery powder, and I didn't know the burn rate, but I knew that it was designed for use in pistols, the very first thing I would do is load a 147 grain bullet with it using 3.5 grains, and shoot it. Then after learning from that, I go from there. Same thing for rifle. I just don't care about books or manufacturer load data for several reasons.
So, about the 3N38 at 10 grains. Well, I know that BLUE DOT at 13 grains using 55 grain bullet, shoots just fine. and I know that BLUE DOT and 3N38 have "similar burn rate" So if I use ~30% less powder than the Blue Dot, this is literally nothing, and I am betting it won't even cycle the gun. you say dangerous, I say it won't even cycle the gun, and I bet its not even 20000 CUP.
The article I write, will pretty much be like "if you could own only 1 powder, what is it?" And the answer would be probably Blue Dot or 3N38, because you can use both of those for Rifle and pistol. Blue Dot is probably better, as it has vastly better case fill I think.
However, I don't care about case fill, because I stuffed the case full of COTTON balls so that the powder is in a "fixed" position, against the primer. The cotton ball will just shoot out and burn up. Like a shotgun wad. Hopefully. (jokes).
Now one can come up with the numbers in a variety of ways, all of which are not precise, just estimates.
For example. If there is load data for subsonic on Titegroup, and it says 3.1 grains = 1050 FPS. Ok. So what is the comparable ratio to 3N38? TG says 3.6 max for 147 grain bullet, 3N38 says around 6.8. So that is almost double, and that is ballpark to get me 1050 FPS. Which is what Hodgdon says is 4000 CUP. That is SUPER LOW pressure. So if I load say..by that ratio...about....near 6.0 grains of 3N38 that will also be near 4000 CUP.
AR15's are about as stout of a piece of hardware you can buy on this planet. the chamber is so strong, its so massively exceedingly strong, you cannot break it. What breaks is the bolt itself. And that is tool steel strong. The ejector gets ripped off, and the upper receiver will split. A few years ago, a person I know did a test. Old beat up AR15, piece of junk. DIPPED the case full of TITEGROUP, loaded 55 grain bullet, and fired it. We are talking like 25+ grains of titegroup. And exactly as predicted, it broke the bolt, and cracked the upper receiver. But the barrel? Fired again, no damage. Oh, it also destroyed the top of the magazine. Blasts always go in path of LEAST resistance. And that would be into the bolt, which moves back, the magazine, and the upper receiver area just beyond the chamber. The bullet itself has no resistance. It goes straight down the open path of barrel, just like anything else would that is not obstructed.
So I don't worry at all about 10 grains of 3N38. That is nothing. Powder puff load, it won't even cycle the gun I am guessing. It is going to take near 12-14 grains of 3N38 to get good velocity and cycle an AR15. I will post pics of the brass with the 10 grains. And measure it. I could be totally wrong, but I don't mind, that is what testing is for, I find out, and I post results.
I don't recommend you or anyone else does what I do, and if you do, its always your own risk. I hope this helps.
So, about the 3N38 at 10 grains. Well, I know that BLUE DOT at 13 grains using 55 grain bullet, shoots just fine. and I know that BLUE DOT and 3N38 have "similar burn rate" So if I use ~30% less powder than the Blue Dot, this is literally nothing, and I am betting it won't even cycle the gun. you say dangerous, I say it won't even cycle the gun, and I bet its not even 20000 CUP.
The article I write, will pretty much be like "if you could own only 1 powder, what is it?" And the answer would be probably Blue Dot or 3N38, because you can use both of those for Rifle and pistol. Blue Dot is probably better, as it has vastly better case fill I think.
However, I don't care about case fill, because I stuffed the case full of COTTON balls so that the powder is in a "fixed" position, against the primer. The cotton ball will just shoot out and burn up. Like a shotgun wad. Hopefully. (jokes).
Now one can come up with the numbers in a variety of ways, all of which are not precise, just estimates.
For example. If there is load data for subsonic on Titegroup, and it says 3.1 grains = 1050 FPS. Ok. So what is the comparable ratio to 3N38? TG says 3.6 max for 147 grain bullet, 3N38 says around 6.8. So that is almost double, and that is ballpark to get me 1050 FPS. Which is what Hodgdon says is 4000 CUP. That is SUPER LOW pressure. So if I load say..by that ratio...about....near 6.0 grains of 3N38 that will also be near 4000 CUP.
AR15's are about as stout of a piece of hardware you can buy on this planet. the chamber is so strong, its so massively exceedingly strong, you cannot break it. What breaks is the bolt itself. And that is tool steel strong. The ejector gets ripped off, and the upper receiver will split. A few years ago, a person I know did a test. Old beat up AR15, piece of junk. DIPPED the case full of TITEGROUP, loaded 55 grain bullet, and fired it. We are talking like 25+ grains of titegroup. And exactly as predicted, it broke the bolt, and cracked the upper receiver. But the barrel? Fired again, no damage. Oh, it also destroyed the top of the magazine. Blasts always go in path of LEAST resistance. And that would be into the bolt, which moves back, the magazine, and the upper receiver area just beyond the chamber. The bullet itself has no resistance. It goes straight down the open path of barrel, just like anything else would that is not obstructed.
So I don't worry at all about 10 grains of 3N38. That is nothing. Powder puff load, it won't even cycle the gun I am guessing. It is going to take near 12-14 grains of 3N38 to get good velocity and cycle an AR15. I will post pics of the brass with the 10 grains. And measure it. I could be totally wrong, but I don't mind, that is what testing is for, I find out, and I post results.
I don't recommend you or anyone else does what I do, and if you do, its always your own risk. I hope this helps.
OK, testing is done. The 10 grains of 3N38 was as I guessed. It would not even cycle the gun, and was ~2200 FPS, powder puff load. I am guessing I will need around 14 grains to cycle gun. My web page is updating with the page, and when its done, I will make new thread and post.
I've run subs from that cast bulletin the second post. It's fun. You could also try using Bullseye and Unique. Both are effective. I use 308 subs for squirrels on the tree stand. 
