Does Concealed Gun Give Cops Right to Search You?

[wozbean]

I ask them about it. If they show me a CCP, I say thank you and have a nice day. if they don't, they go to jail. It's a privilege to carry concealed, not a right - so if LE asks about it, don't give them any grief.

here in the law does it say we must show you our CCP? I think you are incorrect sir. Simply seeing a gun print does NOT entitle you to stop the citizen and "investigate". The ONLY times you are allowed to act in such a manner is when you have REASONABLE SUSPICION or PROBABLE CAUSE. You have to be able to articulate it in court too. "ah, judge, I saw him print, so I searched him" will NOT fly.

Read post #19 by loadnplenty, I think he is 100% correct in how he handles it. In the OP story there was a 911 call and the guy admitted to not having a permit. I feel there was reasonable suspicion and the officer can articulate it in court. "we got a 911 call, I saw a guy with an exposed firearm in a convenience store" It would be even better for the LEO if the store had been robbed before and if it was late at night but the story doesn't say.

 

[RELOADER]

I disagree...the only legal carry that does not require any permit in GA is open carry of a long arm. Anything other than that requires a permit. From a LE perspective and I see someone's handgun printing, I ask them about it. If they show me a CCP, I say thank you and have a nice day. if they don't, they go to jail. It's a privilege to carry concealed, not a right - so if LE asks about it, don't give them any grief.

If the LE can see you printing so can the bad guys buy another holster or a smaller weapon. During a traffic stop I comply with any orders givin by the officers since there are way to many unknowns for you to give a gun law class beside the road. My luck some other fat bald guy in a blue car matching my description exactly just shot at these cop two blocks back!!!

 

[pef]

I disagree...the only legal carry that does not require any permit in GA is open carry of a long arm. Anything other than that requires a permit. From a LE perspective and I see someone's handgun printing, I ask them about it. If they show me a CCP, I say thank you and have a nice day. if they don't, they go to jail. It's a privilege to carry concealed, not a right - so if LE asks about it, don't give them any grief.

What would be the reasonable articulable suspicion to make the investigative stop or probable cause for the arrest?

 

[loadnplenty]

What would be the reasonable articulable suspicion to make the investigative stop or probable cause for the arrest?

"Techniclly" speaking if an L.E.O. see's somebody out in public and they have a firearm you could ask to see their permit once you have knowledge they posses a concealed one. the word "KNOWLEDGE" refers to plainview or obvious outline or printing as been reffered to here. The officer must be able to articulaute his reasoning in court. In doing this my personal belief it gets back to where, what they are doing, and how they are acting.

Carrying a gun and acting stupid and being seen with it in public is kinda like driving through a license check, let me see your license. If carried properly nobody will ever know you have one. Having said that, had the store clerks not been so careless as to start showing them to one another in sight of customers, that convicted felon might still be toting today.

99% of arrests made by officers are based on officer descretion, and most of those are based on actions that somebody did to draw their interest. There are laid back officers and officers that hold the world in suspicion and to a degree we need both for various reasons (thats another topic within itself).

If carried properly most of you will never be asked to show a permit. In my career in most cases people hand me there permit with there license at license checks and such. My repsonse once I see they are wearing a safety belt and can show a valid drivers license " Have a safe trip"!!!

Just my opinion on this based on almost 15 years worth of answering calls for such, is people who open carry in public. You make others nervous such as one who don't beieve we should be able to carry. Also shall you become a target/victim of a criminal you are telling him or her how to prepare to deal with you. In most cases that is with a pistol in your face from the time you see them.

 

[pef]

To the original post - carrying concealed DOES NOT give police the right to SEARCH you.

Police must have a reasonable articulable Suspicion that CRIMINAL activity is afoot before they can even detain you. However, for all I know the police just received a call that a guy matching my description was committing a crime. So the officer may have RAS. So if a police officer stops me, I will likely answer his question and not pull out my pocket copy of the constitution. Why turn a 30 second Q&A into a 30 minute constitutional standoff? Some may disagree but that's my approach.

But if you are obeying the law and all the officer is going on is that you are printing, the officer does not have the ability to detain you. He can certainly ask you any question and you can comply voluntarily.

I think loadnplenty's approach is pretty reasonable - Quite positive in fact. Unfortunately the Internet provides a disproportionate voice to the aggrieved, as most people that have positive encounters with the police rarely post about them. Some websites make it sound like we live in a police state, but that is a discussion for which I have neither the time, energy or interest in engaging...

 

[jwhited]

I think most here will agree with me - Exercising one right does not negate another.

 

[rOmiLaYu]

I've got to disagree with: "It's a privilege to carry concealed, not a right -" Actually it is a constitutional right...No offense meant here, and I realize there is a lot of truth in your statement. I know that we have "laws" we have to abide by...but our founders did not intend the 2nd Amendment to be a government granted privilege.

No offense taken...however, I would argue that a "constitutional right" is nothing more than a government granted privilege. Your "rights" only exist because the government exists and creates an environment for them to do so. Notice that the 2nd amendment is not part of the "unalienable" rights referred to in the preface. Make no mistake, your CCW is a privilege granted to you by the government...if it was a right, anyone could do it...just like, voting, hunting, fishing, and marriage.

But if you are obeying the law and all the officer is going on is that you are printing, the officer does not have the ability to detain you. He can certainly ask you any question and you can comply voluntarily.

My point exactly...if LE sees a handgun concealed, it is reasonable for them to ascertain the legality of said weapon, having done that, they should go about their day.

 

[wozbean]

I don't really want to get into an argument but I think some lines are crossed a little.

"Techaniclly" speaking if an L.E.O. see's somebody out in public and they have a firearm you could ask to see their permit once you have knowledge they posses a concealed one. the word "KNOWLEDGE" refers to plainview or obvious outline or printing as been refered to here.

Seeing a printed gun is not reasonable suspicion.

Carrying a gun and acting stupid and being seen with it in public is kinda like driving through a license check, let me see your license. If carried properly nobody will ever know you have one. Having said that, had the store clerks not been so careless as to start showing them to one another in sight of customers, that convicted felon might still be toting today.

define being stupid. seeing a printed gun and making faces etc is not reasonable suspicion (maybe you could argue you thought the person was mentally unstable making a firearm illegal). seeing a printed gun and the guy "casing" the joint would be. ALSO (yes I know it's a small difference) you are required to show your drivers license but there is no law stating you must present your CCP. Only that you have one. Yes I realize it makes it difficult for the LEO to verify but still it's not required by law to present when asked.

If carried properly nobody will ever know you have one. Having said that, had the store clerks not been so careless as to start showing them to one another in sight of customers, that convicted felon might still be toting today.

let's ignore the fact there was a 911 call giving reasonable suspicion. Just because one felon was caught (let's say he was searched without the 911 call) does not mean that the search was legal. I am not willing to forgo my rights just because one felon was detained via an illegal search (I do believe though the OP was legal due to the 911).

I can't say what I would do personally because I haven't been pulled over or detained (except once but I didn't have my gun) in probably 20 years. All I ask is that everyone understand the law and make reasonable decisions (and ask reasonable questions) when the situation arises. Simply following along because that is what everyone else does or that's what the people on the internet say to do or even because that's what the LEO says (they are allowed to lie and don't always know the law) to do is not acceptable to me. Know the law, know your rights and make your own decisions. But don't except me to go along just because, I will decide on my own when/if the situation presents itself. That is all.

 

[wozbean]

My point exactly...if LE sees a handgun concealed, it is reasonable for them to ascertain the legality of said weapon, having done that, they should go about their day.

SIMPLY WRONG

No offense taken...however, I would argue that a "constitutional right" is nothing more than a government granted privilege. Your "rights" only exist because the government exists and creates an environment for them to do so. Notice that the 2nd amendment is not part of the "unalienable" rights referred to in the preface. Make no mistake, your CCW is a privilege granted to you by the government...if it was a right, anyone could do it...just like, voting, hunting, fishing, and marriage.

I don't even know where to start on this one. The (federal) government honestly has no right to license any of those things. These are areas where the majority of people decided to allow the government to intervene. It's a source of revenue for the machine. And where people who thought things weren't fair decided they needed to try and make it fair. Should they be regulated by the local government/state, maybe, but the federal government? I don't think so.

The government does NOT exist to grant us privileges. I am more "an armed (free) society is a polite society" kind of guy rather than a "licensed and regulated society is a polite society (read big government)". I want to see a small limited government.

 

[WyldeDime]

I disagree...the only legal carry that does not require any permit in GA is open carry of a long arm. Anything other than that requires a permit. From a LE perspective and I see someone's handgun printing, I ask them about it. If they show me a CCP, I say thank you and have a nice day. if they don't, they go to jail. It's a privilege to carry concealed, not a right - so if LE asks about it, don't give them any grief.

Are you a cop?