Jeep 3.0 Deisel Opinions

[moosensquirrel]

The new 3.0 diesel is a VM Motori motor, not the Mercedes. Development was started on the engine in cooperation with GM/Cadillac, but scrapped during the financial meltdown. FCA finished the development for the Ram 1500 and the Jeep GC.



My fear is in the mechanical reliability, including the emissions systems. 2014 models had a lot of problems out of the gate, but over the last couple of years, they seem to have worked it out.

Fuel wise, the diesel gets about 40% more mileage than the Hemi. And to be fair, you have to compare apples to apples, the Hemi requires mid grade gas, which cost the same as diesel on average. Even if you consider regular gas, diesel is only 10% more, so the math actually does work out to an advantage. I like my current 5.7, but with the AWD I get 9-11mpg city, which is most of what I do.

That is probably so with "new" diesels, but with this, you also get a more complicated emissions and fuel delivery system. One of my vehicles is a 2004 F250 (late build so no real problems). When I first got it, I could run empty at 80mph and get 22-23 mpg on flat ground. When 500ppm "low sulfur" fuel came in, it dropped to 20mpg. Now with "ultra low sulfur" diesel, I am lucky to get 16mpg. Regardless, even after 12 years, the conventional Ford dealers could not reliably repair it the few times it was needed. I had to take it to Powerstroke Specialties in Buford and have it bulletproofed to finally make it reliable. I expect to get another 300k miles out of it. They know what they are doing. I now get 18mpg more or less.

 

[roundhouse]

I'd stay away from any modern diesel
Far too many problems caused by the emission components

And I just can fathom an Italian Diesel engine in a jeep built by Fiat lasting very long anyway

I wouldn't worry about the fuel mileage
If you are buying a brand new car the depreciation is going to cost you 10X what the fuel will

I'd shop carefully and buy a 6-8 yr old grand Cherokee
They don't hold their value and are very reasonable in that age range

The only jeep that doesn't drop like a rock in value is the 4 door wrangler


Edited to add
Just noticed you already have a GC
Keep it
If it's a few years old it won't depreciate much more


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[Smiley]

I'd stay away from any modern diesel
Far too many problems caused by the emission components

And I just can fathom an Italian Diesel engine in a jeep built by Fiat lasting very long anyway

I wouldn't worry about the fuel mileage
If you are buying a brand new car the depreciation is going to cost you 10X what the fuel will

I'd shop carefully and buy a 6-8 yr old grand Cherokee
They don't hold their value and are very reasonable in that age range

The only jeep that doesn't drop like a rock in value is the 4 door wrangler


Edited to add
Just noticed you already have a GC
Keep it
If it's a few years old it won't depreciate much more


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I don't buy new cars. That said, I don't want to work on one anymore either. My GC has been a good one, but the milage is getting a bit high and its 12 years old, there are several things that are just going to need attention. Years ago I used to love working on cars, modifying them, etc. I absolutely despise it now. I had a Rubicon TJ before this and I loved it, just got hard to get the kids in and out of, and all the wranglers ride like wagons. There is not a full size vehicle I would consider buying, but I want the power of one. I looked into the 4-runners, but they are pretty bland on the inside. The Tacomas and Colorados are okay, but I have no need for a truck.

 

[roundhouse]

Yeah, I don't buy new cars. That said, I don't want to work on one anymore either. My GC has been a good one, but the milage is getting a bit high and its 12 years old, there are several things that are just going to need attention. Years ago I used to love working on cars, modifying them, etc. I absolutely despise it now. I had a Rubicon TJ before this and I loved it, just got hard to get the kids in and out of, and all the wranglers ride like wagons. There is not a full size vehicle I would consider buying, but I want the power of one. I looked into the 4-runners, but they are pretty bland on the inside. The Tacomas and Colorados are okay, but I have no need for a truck.

Some of The 4 runners had V-8s

Sure. Your 12 use old vehicle is gonna need some maintenance and replacement of consumable items like water pump, alternator radatior etc
But it's a lot cheaper to pay someone to do all that at once than to buy another newer vehicle that's gonna depreciate $800 a month


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[westernjeep401]

I have the 15' Summit Eco; pull a 28' Airstream with it almost exclusively, approx 9k accumulated as a puller thus far.

In ATL traffic, it averages 26; open highway 31; with the Airstream, 18.6. The PMI service interval retails for about $150 +/- for the basic B interval. I service the truck in my own shop.

When trailer towing, using the "Sport" mode is akin to a "Trailer Tow" setting otherwise. Using the manual transmission control paddles are a lot more intuitive than I first imagined, but you will forget that you have placed it in a higher gear, which will remain in-place as you slow, causing a lug condition which might result in a MIL (lack of/loss of sufficient EGR flow).

It is very responsive, with very good torque off-line. It is noisy, but not 6.2/6.5 GM popcorn popper noisy, just rhythmic clatter noise that the acoustic cabin does a good job muffling. There is zero turbo whine.

Servicing the horizontal fuel module (fuel filters) is easy, with a drain plug that stays in place after you loosen it. There are two filter elements in tandem, with the replacements from Wix having the plastic covers and o-rings already installed and ready to use. Cabin air filter is a cartridge and easy to change. The engine air filter is a familiar rectangular pleat design. Lube oil filter is an element design that requires a little dexterity to replace; it's replaced topside, with you moving the air intake snorkel over. Of note, wait 10 minutes or so for the oil in the filter housing to drain. It holds 8 quarts of 5/30 synthetic, which is specific to this and other clean diesels certified for use in North America (and europe).

The 8HP70 8-speed is a solid unit; this is the second one I've personally owned and pulled trailers with, the first being behind a HEMI. Note that it, like many other recent automatics, does NOT have a transmission dipstick; fluid is filled either using a transfusion machine, or via a underside fill/drain.

As far as systems reliability, well, it runs like a sewing machine and allows us to drive 350-400 miles between fueling stops while towing. This is huge. After dropping the trailer, you then have the advantage of using normal car-sized parking spots, which is really nice.

VM makes a solid product. Transportation has been a global enterprise now for like 20 years, with the last 10 seeing almost all automotive/construction/trucking products being of a global design nature rather than carrying the old "fix it again tony" stereotypes of the past. Customers ask me what car to buy, my reply is "buy what you like best".

Currently own several diesel Jeeps, and perform all preventative, service, and repair maintenance to them.

 

[Smiley]

Excellent. What do you think of the latest investigation to the software for emissions violations?

By the way, you're killing me. I want an Airstream so bad I can't stand it. My little intown 1923 bungalow just doesn't have the room.

 

[Nob0dy]

I don't if this matters but Cummins has made a crate engine for Jeeps now:

 

[westernjeep401]

Excellent. What do you think of the latest investigation to the software for emissions violations?

By the way, you're killing me. I want an Airstream so bad I can't stand it. My little intown 1923 bungalow just doesn't have the room.

I do not have enough information to make a determination. However, I find it odd that the CBEA/CJAA were submitted (to CARB) for emissions validation....and certified by them....to begin with. You make serious waves when you have a product that is clean, quiet, fast, and provides the customer a 700 mile range estimate (in Passat form). It's all academic now, as the VW attorney team admitted corporate culpability, which I suspect, means they'd already determined it was more cost-effective to admit guilt and apologize regardless of what the truth was. This event did set-back automotive technology perhaps a decade; the long-term damage is incalculable. This is because innovators will decide more and more it's not worth being sued.

There were a couple folks that towed their streams with CJA powered Jetta wagons with the DSG. This was before the VM 3.0 came on line en masse.

The technology behind the modern clean diesel crystalized around 2000, with the advent of Bosch high-pressure, full-authority, computer-controlled fueling. CAT/Navistar used the HUEI approach, which failed to produce the results they were looking for, and is dead. Siemens/VDO makes their own CR version (6.4 Stroke). Almost everyone else uses the Bosch accumulator rail system, including DMAX, Cummins, Iveco, VM, Duetz, etc. Pretty basic stuff.