Argue for Mandated Training So As To Exercise a Basic Civil Right

[RamRoddoc]

My understanding is that GCO asked the GA arm of the group Concealed Carry on Campus what they wanted us to do. They requested we not stand in the way of it, if it was the only way they could carry on campus and work next year to take it out much in the way we got restaurants that serve alcohol one year, then remove the consumption restriction the next. Steps.

Mine too. They "asked" the students, rather than commit them to a dictated policy. Sounds an awful lot like freedom to me as far as GCO is concerned.

Steps are how rights are frequently removed and appropriately to restore them. Historically any drastic swing typically ends in revolt on both ends.

 

[Cobalt 60]

The comparison to driving is actually proof of the argument that training and a class won't do a damn thing. Look at some of the people driving around and the way they drive. They all had the "training" and passed the test.

 

[mountainpass]

Mine too. They "asked" the students, rather than commit them to a dictated policy. Sounds an awful lot like freedom to me as far as GCO is concerned.

Steps are how rights are frequently removed and appropriately to restore them. Historically any drastic swing typically ends in revolt on both ends.

There is more to it that I can't get into here.
But that is past, let's work hard in the next few weeks to keep it out of this years bill.

You(not you RR, I'm talking everyone) should be on a first name basis with your Reps. Call them or go see them and let them know how you feel. If you want training then don't, that is all.

 

[RamRoddoc]

An honest after action review will hopefully identify what went well so it can be repeated and what did not go well so it can be avoided.

In politics good luck finding out who left the turd in the pool as no one will admit culpability, however there is a turd or turds in the pool and no one has removed them yet.

 

[FbodTrek]

You could train everyone in this country and you would still have accidental gun deaths. we are all going to die one way or another. Everyone should grow a set of balls and quit expecting big brother to make them safe. That is the problem with this country everyone expects the government to make them live longer and better lives. I am scared to die, lets give everyone healthcare; I am scared to die and guns kill people, lets ban the guns; Im scared to be poor, lets redistribute the wealth. It is all a bunch of BS, we need to start accepting that it is our personal responsibility to change what we can to improve our lives not the government. End of rant have a nice day and grow some balls

best comment ever.

 

[InitialKev]

You could train everyone in this country and you would still have accidental gun deaths. we are all going to die one way or another. Everyone should grow a set of balls and quit expecting big brother to make them safe. That is the problem with this country everyone expects the government to make them live longer and better lives. I am scared to die, lets give everyone healthcare; I am scared to die and guns kill people, lets ban the guns; Im scared to be poor, lets redistribute the wealth. It is all a bunch of BS, we need to start accepting that it is our personal responsibility to change what we can to improve our lives not the government. End of rant have a nice day and grow some balls

I wholeheartedly agree with you. It's impossible to prevent accidents or crime or whatever a 100% but does that mean we don't try at all?

Mind you I oppose Obamacare and gun bans. I believe the rich should pay the exact same percentage of taxes as the poor and everyone else in between. I believe that some people should get off their butts and work to better themselves and stop relying on government welfare. I do take personal responsibility but sadly a lot of people don't.

 

[InitialKev]

This pretty much tells me all I need to know. I wonder if you find other Constitutional arguments weak.

Btw in 2010 there were 606 accidental firearm deaths. In 2010 there were 32,788 car accident deaths. Estimates are there around 190 - 300 million firearms in the US, and there is an estimated 250 million cars in the US. So basically your comparison between driving and firearm ownership holds no water.

Until you actually take a firearms training class, you should probably spare us all the hypocrisy.

I don't believe other constitutional arguments are weak because they don't involve people having a dangerous weapon. Do you believe criminals or violent people should have guns? What about kids?

Millions of people drive every single day. The more they are on the road the more likely they are to get into an accident. How many people use their firearms everyday? That I have no idea but I'm willing to bet it's a lot less than people that drive. Even law enforcement don't use their guns everyday so your argument doesn't hold as much water as you think it does.

If I were to take a training course I would immediately cease to be a hypocrite even if my views remain the same? Would I be a hypocrite if I said alcoholics should go to AA meetings but I haven't been to one myself?

 

[InitialKev]

The comparison to driving is actually proof of the argument that training and a class won't do a damn thing. Look at some of the people driving around and the way they drive. They all had the "training" and passed the test.

I could imagine it to be a whole lot worse if driving wasn't regulated. There's always going to be people who don't conform with the norm no matter which subject we're talking about.

 

[BIKER13]

i never have been trained to shoot a pistol,so what?

 

[InitialKev]

Then you should have no problem finding the statistics I asked for to back up your argument.

FWIW, I'm not arguing against getting training. I'm saying that it shouldn't be a government mandated requirement.

And if you want to talk "common sense", what is more "common sense" than reality staring you in the face? The reality that says that no one has yet to provide any evidence that mandatory, expensive, and inconvenient training requirements significantly reduce the number of idiots carrying weapons or reduce the number of accidents that happen every year. In fact, the only effect that increasing requirements has, according to actual studies and research and not just your own version of "common sense" is that it reduced participation.



People most certainly would think differently about something if that something was somehow different than it is now. How they would think about it, I have no idea. I did not make any claims as to how they would think differently. I'm not aware of any studies that have attempted to tackle that question. I'm not even sure how that would be studied. Heck, maybe they wouldn't think differently about it at all, I don't know.

You, however, are making specific claims about the value of training requirements when it comes to carrying handguns in public. If it's as simple a situation as you seem to be claiming, you should have no trouble finding something to back that claim up, right?

Honestly I don't know if that information even exist but I really can't see why you would deny that having safety training would increase safety. Have you not witness the effectiveness of having safety/ training courses from your own personal experience? Maybe in the job place?

You did make a claim about how people would "most certainly" and "undoubtedly" think different. So where's the statistic on that?

I'm not disagreeing with you that having restrictions will deter people from getting into guns.