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Private Entity Leasing Government Property

Thread in 'Law & Order' started by GAgunLAWbooklet, Sep 2, 2016.

  1. GAgunLAWbooklet

    GAgunLAWbooklet The Hen that laid the Golden Legos

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    GeorgiaCarry.Org has been litigating a case involving member Philip Evans being kicked out of the Atlanta Botanical Gardens for carrying his firearm there. The Gardens is located on public property, but it is operated and managed by a private entity. That private entity claims to have the power to make its own rules and codes of conduct for the facility, including a gun ban with no exception for private citizens with GWLs (carry permits).

    The first time the case went to the Superior Court of Fulton County, we lost on a technicality. The judge said that courts have no power to order a business owner from having somebody thrown off the property, or even arrested for trespass, based on a criminal law.

    GCO appealed it to the Ga. Supreme Court, which said that the reasons for the lower judge's ruling were incorrect. The Supreme Court said that it's OK for a Superior Court to declare what conduct could or could not justify a business having somebody arrested or banning a paying customer from the property by using the criminal trespass law. The high court sent the case back to the lower court to rule on the real issues of the case.
    http://caselaw.findlaw.com/ga-supreme-court/1734609.html

    So it went back to Judge Gail Tusan of the Fulton Co. Superior Court, and she ruled that when a private entity rents or leases a public facility, it becomes "private property" for the purposes of applying gun control laws. So such a "private property" leaseholder or manager of the facility CAN have a gun ban in place, and can enforce it, even though the real estate is public property. The business being run on that land, inside those government-owned walls, is a private business.
    http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/judge-rules-guns-are-not-allowed-in-atlanta-botani/nsQDy/

    WHY THIS IS IMPORTANT :

    It's not just about the Atlanta Botanical Gardens.

    The same issue has come up with regard to a private air show promoter having a "no guns" rule for an air show event one weekend, held at a public airport. In that case, a different judge also ruled that "Wings Over North Georgia" (the air show promoter) had the right to make any and all rules it wanted for the Air Show, without relying on any grant of authority found in any County ordinance or state law. The lease contract between Floyd County (owner of this public airport) and Wings Over North Georgia, LLC was the only thing needed to give rule-making power to the business entity that rented this public facility.

    And it's not just about air shows.

    As Judge Matthews observed in the air show case, if the gun rights people are correct in our interpretation of what state preemption means, and that public property cannot have any gun restrictions other than what is found in O.C.G.A. uniform state law passed by the legislature itself, then all these professional sports teams that play at public areas and stadiums would not be allowed to ban guns. GWL holders could wear their pistols to any NBA basketball game, NFL football game, etc., if the game were held at a public facility.

    This issue might even come up for a GUN SHOW, as some gun show management companies have a "no guns" and "no ammo" policy for visitors to the gun show. They zip-tie your weapon and forbid you to have any loose ammo in your possession. That's the rule made by the private gun show promoter / management company. But when the gun show is held at a public exhibition hall or arena or other public property venue, can they really make and enforce a gun ban?
    Well, they ARE.
     
  2. GAgunLAWbooklet

    GAgunLAWbooklet The Hen that laid the Golden Legos

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    Just so we're all on the same page, a quick reminder:

    For truly public property, the government has no power to make any rule or have any policy against guns.
    State preemption applies, per Code section 16-11-173.
    Managers of public property have no authority to use the "criminal trespass" law to eject or ban armed citizens who are not otherwise breaking any law or other rule about disruptive behavior. O.C.G.A. 16-11-126 used to say that persons who owned or were in control of any property could use the criminal trespass law to enforce the rules for the property, but as of 2014, House Bill 60 (Safe Carry Protection Act) amended that to say that such a power only applies to PRIVATE property. The word "private" was added in this law and other statutes that cross-reference the same issue.

    So the real question is: Is Public Property still "public" and not private when the government has leased it or turned over the management of it to some private association, company, nonprofit group, or other "private" entity?
     
  3. cooter

    cooter Expert know-it-all. Supporter

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    I was just reading the news article on the botanical gardens. Just another method or eroding our 2nd amendment rights. The way I see it, if it's government property then it belongs to us the people, NOT some damn botanical garden. If they want to control gun rights then they should be forced to purchase their own property.

    The way I understand it happened was the Ga supreme court said to the Fulton county judge "hey fool...you can't do dis" the Fulton county judge said "oh yes I can!! Jus you watch me!!"

    Sorry for the Ebonics....I only read redneck papers.
     
  4. palmettomoon

    palmettomoon The Hen that laid the Golden Legos Supporter

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    Having been present at three gunshows over the past twenty years where morons had neg discharges, I agree with the no loaded guns policies that promoters usually enforce. Each ND was a "gun dealer" by the way.
     
  5. GAgunLAWbooklet

    GAgunLAWbooklet The Hen that laid the Golden Legos

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    Yeah, but this thread isn't about the wisdom of a no-guns rule. The issue is the authority of a person in charge of a government-owned facility (public property) to have such a rule, when the rule is more restrictive than what the state's own gun control laws are, as they are published in the O.C.G.A.
     
    SchmittZoid likes this.
  6. palmettomoon

    palmettomoon The Hen that laid the Golden Legos Supporter

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    I get that, just pointing out the reaaon for a promoter to enact such a rule.
     
  7. poopdaddy

    poopdaddy ODT Junkie!

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    the only way to fix is it BLM style. and no one on our side wants to give their time.
    to change this we need to go to the garden, stand at the entrance with signs and our weapons (holstered). we need to disrupt their business (politely no burning cars). until we can organize some sort of resistance, they will continue to take larger pieces of ground...

    it seems a lot of people, even on here are live and let live. thats all fine and good, but its getting to the place that its live and let take.
     
    RNC likes this.
  8. tommyt654

    tommyt654 ODT Junkie!

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    Yup,Imma gunna carry my gun at the gardens because of them thar bee's that might attack me an my family,screw Bee Live Matter,lol
     
  9. alnen

    alnen ODT Junkie!

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    Nds can happen anywhere. Are you for having loaded guns barred everywhere?
     
    Lionheart likes this.
  10. tommyt654

    tommyt654 ODT Junkie!

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    NDS cannot happen anywhere,only where guns are allowed.
     
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