Reloading for self defense...

[VHinch]

I'm not saying that I believe that you shouldn't carry reloads because of the above, merely pointing out that in can be a factor IF there are enough other factors where you end up in court over a shoot.

Of the 4, the Bias case is the most disturbing. The defendant claimed it was a suicide attempt, which according to reports the police initially believed. Because the forensic evidence didn't add up though, the man spent the next 10 years defending himself at the cost of becoming bankrupt and still ended up a convicted felon.

If I needed to carry reloads for whatever reason I would and the last thing I'd be worried about was any liability because of it. But like ngcsugrad09, I just don't see any good reason to do it. I reload for bulk, not for precision. Could I take additional steps and add the precision I'd want to load defense ammunition? Sure, but again, why bother?

 

[Wheeler]

The lawyer of who ever you shoot with em, will have a field day.

Yeah, that's already been disproved...

 

[Springfield 1911]

I'm not saying that I believe that you shouldn't carry reloads because of the above, merely pointing out that in can be a factor IF there are enough other factors where you end up in court over a shoot.

Of the 4, the Bias case is the most disturbing. The defendant claimed it was a suicide attempt, which according to reports the police initially believed. Because the forensic evidence didn't add up though, the man spent the next 10 years defending himself at the cost of becoming bankrupt and still ended up a convicted felon.

If I needed to carry reloads for whatever reason I would and the last thing I'd be worried about was any liability because of it. But like ngcsugrad09, I just don't see any good reason to do it. I reload for bulk, not for precision. Could I take additional steps and add the precision I'd want to load defense ammunition? Sure, but again, why bother?

There is where we differ. I load to get the most out of my firearms. I still use two old single stage presses and charge each case myself. I ain't pulling the trigger on a load that I am not sure is safe.

 

[VHinch]

So no convictions based on handloaded ammo. The one that I underlined and bolded in the NJ case is complete crap. IN GA if you are justified in shooting you are exempt form criminal and civil penalties.

I don't disagree at all. If it's a good shoot, it's likely never going to matter anyway.

As far as the NJ case goes, crap or not it cost the guy 10 years of his life and a felony conviction, and justified shoot wasn't a factor and wouldn't be in GA either in an identical case. In that specific case had the guy used factory ammunition it's very likely the death would have been ruled a suicide and never even gotten to court.

 

[Springfield 1911]

I don't disagree at all. If it's a good shoot, it's likely never going to matter anyway.

As far as the NJ case goes, crap or not it cost the guy 10 years of his life and a felony conviction, and justified shoot wasn't a factor and wouldn't be in GA either in an identical case. In that specific case had the guy used factory ammunition it's very likely the death would have been ruled a suicide and never even gotten to court.

There you go! And I think we all agree that NJ is crap.

 

[VHinch]

There is where we differ. I load to get the most out of my firearms. I still use two old single stage presses and charge each case myself. I ain't pulling the trigger on a load that I am not sure is safe.

I don't do anything unsafe, I just don't reload to the level of precision I'd need to if I was going to trust the reloads for carry. If I was going to reload for carry I'd do a lot of things that I don't for what I'm trying to achieve, i.e., weigh each charge, etc. I shoot 12-15k rounds a year, and probably 10-12k of that is reloads. At that volume of reloading I'm using a progressive press to gain efficiency. The trade off of that efficiency is accepting variance that is within the accepted deviation, but above what I'd accept for defensive purposes.

 

[Springfield 1911]

I don't do anything unsafe, I just don't reload to the level of precision I'd need to if I was going to trust the reloads for carry. If I was going to reload for carry I'd do a lot of things that I don't for what I'm trying to achieve, i.e., weigh each charge, etc. I shoot 12-15k rounds a year, and probably 10-12k of that is reloads. At that volume of reloading I'm using a progressive press to gain efficiency. The trade off of that efficiency is accepting variance that is within the accepted deviation, but above what I'd accept for defensive purposes.

I am sorry I did not mean to infer that you were unsafe, just that as you said there is going to be a defect rate in doing things on a progressive.

 

[Wheeler]

I am sorry I did not mean to infer that you were unsafe, just that as you said there is going to be a defect rate in doing things on a progressive.

I've been reloading for about fifteen years now on a progressive and the only defects have been user induced. I've reloaded well over 25,000 .38 Special and about 5000 .357 mag.

 

[jcountry]

The lawyer of who ever you shoot with em, will have a field day.

I agree.

The problem is that juries are full of stupid people who know nothing about anything. It would be a prosecutor's wet dream to paint you as some kind of nut job for whom "factory ammo was not deadly enough!"

We all know that is complete BS. But some jury morons might not.

Don't underestimate the completely unethical and immoral crap a prosecutor will pull to get a conviction.

(And this is only a discussion of the criminal side of things. The civil side could be much worse, financially.)

I only carry with factory ammo.

(I am no lawyer-but I had a good friend who was a successful criminal defense attorney. He made a believer out of me. People tend to assume that prosecutors are the good guys. They often are horrible people who will do anything to be able to boast about a higher conviction rate than their old frat buddy. Don't assume for a second that a prosecutor is above this kind of dirty pool.)

 

[woodstock]

unless you decide to tell Leos you used reloads, why would it ever come up? Maybe they would ask this or check your ammo but I think it would not be something that would be of interest.

I've been reloading for about fifteen years now on a progressive and the only defects have been user induced. I've reloaded well over 25,000 .38 Special and about 5000 .357 mag.

Is that all?