So you want all my information......

[gh1950]

Yes, if you close, all your 4473's in the past 20 years must be turned in. But, federal law still prohibits the ATF from putting them in a searchable database so they are literally stored in storage containers. So if the ATF wants to know exactly how many guns John Jacob Smith has had transferred to him on a 4473 they will still need to physically check every FFL in the country plus finger through the hundreds of thousands they have stored from closed businesses. It would be a seemingly impossible task.

Apparently.

I had one of the few new guns I've ever purchased new, stolen. Had the receipt from the FFL, knew the exact date of sale. But needed the serial number from the gun (another long story).

My bad luck is that the FFL had lost it's license in the ensuing years, and yes, the 4473s go back to BATF. Apparently they store them in the warehouse you see in the last scene in Indiana Jones, because despite several requests from the local LEO, BATF couldn't (or wouldn't) find the 4473 (which I needed for the serial number). Since that experience I haven't obsessed over the BATF having that info. I'm not planning a mass murder, which seems to be about the only time BATF goes to the trouble.

Here's the P.S., the physical location of the FFL had stayed the same and continuously operating, but the actual FFL was in a different name. I knew that it had happened, but hadn't made the connection that all the 4473s had gone north somewhere.

 

[Fatal_Bert]

Apparently.

I had one of the few new guns I've ever purchased new, stolen. Had the receipt from the FFL, knew the exact date of sale. But needed the serial number from the gun (another long story).

My bad luck is that the FFL had lost it's license in the ensuing years, and yes, the 4473s go back to BATF. Apparently they store them in the warehouse you see in the last scene in Indiana Jones, because despite several requests from the local LEO, BATF couldn't (or wouldn't) find the 4473 (which I needed for the serial number). Since that experience I haven't obsessed over the BATF having that info. I'm not planning a mass murder, which seems to be about the only time BATF goes to the trouble.

Here's the P.S., the physical location of the FFL had stayed the same and continuously operating, but the actual FFL was in a different name. I knew that it had happened, but hadn't made the connection that all the 4473s had gone north somewhere.

Yep, pawn shop I worked for had a change of ownership while I was there, it just went from the owners stepfather's name to his even though he had been running it forever he finally got it officially in his name and that meant a new FFL.

We had people with your same situation come in all the time, wanting us to look up there guns serial number. Before the switch we would do it if they new the date they bought it, if not tough luck cause ain't nobody got time to be digging through files. But After the switch all we could do is give them the number to the ATF. Never once did I here of anyone having any luck with that haha. Unless it's a high profile case the ATF don't give a ****.

People watch to much CSI and NCIS though and think any cop can just punch your name in a computer and find out every gun you ever bought new or from a dealer.

 

[gh1950]

Yep, pawn shop I worked for had a change of ownership while I was there, it just went from the owners stepfather's name to his even though he had been running it forever he finally got it officially in his name and that meant a new FFL.

We had people with your same situation come in all the time, wanting us to look up there guns serial number. Before the switch we would do it if they new the date they bought it, if not tough luck cause ain't nobody got time to be digging through files. But After the switch all we could do is give them the number to the ATF. Never once did I here of anyone having any luck with that haha. Unless it's a high profile case the ATF don't give a ****.

People watch to much CSI and NCIS though and think any cop can just punch your name in a computer and find out every gun you ever bought new or from a dealer.

Yeah, I know the gun store owner pretty well, and I was willing to help dig through the forms (which wasn't a big deal because we knew the date), but the 4473 had all gone to that big warehouse somewhere.

LEO even gave me number for ATF, and it was worse than calling credit card services. Every time, it was a different person, and the response was "WHAAAAAAAT?"

 

[RidgeRunner762]

So you want all my information including a copy of my Drivers License and GWCL to sell me a firearm.....

Isn't that all the info we're told NOT to let anyone have? And everything needed to steal my identy?

Nope. NO way. NOT happening.

Noobs..... but not always...

And don't get me started on "meet at FFL to do transfer"... ???!!!!
What state do these people think we're in?

To those that applies to - LEAVE YOUR DRACONIAN GUN LAWS IN THE STATE YOU CAME FROM. OR, JUST GO BACK.

I normally don't reply or get involved in chats or discussion threads BUT, if I may convey my personal experience as a manager-buyer at a large gun store for 7 years and I am still in the gun industry on the manufacturing side.
First, the 4473 form you fill out at a FFL dealer, its INTENDED use is to aid in an investigation of a crime, i.e. firearm recovered from a crime scene. Just like a Car, ETC. If that happens the investigating law enforcement agency reports the serial number to the ATF, then the ATF does a gun trace, which involves contacting that particular gun manufacturer to see which wholesaler sold it to which dealer to what customer at what date. At that point then the original purchaser of the firearm is divulged. depending on whether or not the firearm was reported stolen, then the original owner may or may not be contacted for reference to the firearms history. If the ATF starts knocking on doors for all 4473 titled firearms this country is in DIRE STRAITS.(WOLVERINES) There is NO gun registration in Georgia. But with that said if I sell a firearm that I filled out 4473 paperwork on or not, I MUST BE REASONABLLY SURE that the person that I'm selling to is not restricted from owning a firearm, I personally don't care who you are or where you live but it is certainly not unreasonable for me to ask to see a persons VALID GADL and VALID GA carry permit to carry out my transaction so if by chance my former firearm is recovered at a crime scene, when and if questioned I will be able to state that the firearm in question was sold to someone (at that time) with a valid GADL and a valid GA carry permit to cover my tail. And I don't have a problem showing mine as I have nothing to hide. So if that's a problem for some people I respect that, then don't do business with me, but if someone chooses to do business with me that's how it is.
Noted with respect to every ones choice of business.

 

[chris.jackson]

I just did a trade and showed my DL and GWCL, like I always do. Other guy showed his. Neither of us asked for, or copied each others license and nobody died.
We both had a lot of positive feedback so all is well in the world.

 

[GAgunLAWbooklet]

I don't want to keep a copy of anybody's ID with their actual DOB on it, nor their SSN.
(Neither a driver's license nor a GWL has the SSN on it, anyway, right?)
Keeping that information is a potential liability for me.
If it were stolen from me, by hacking or burglary or something, it certainly COULD be used in identity theft and other fraud.
So I'd rather not even possess that level of personal information on folks I buy, sell, or trade guns with.

I'll LOOK at the ID cards, but not copy them and save the copies.
Looking allows me to say I did my "due diligence" without creating issues of identity theft.

 

[GAgunLAWbooklet]

P.S. I don't insist on seeing a GWL when selling a handgun, because there are plenty of qualified buyers, law-abiding citizens and residents of this state, that don't have a GWL.
No license is required to own a handgun or keep it in your home, your car, or your place of business, or anywhere on your own property. Most gun owners I know outside of gun chat forums are NOT g.w.l. holders, and they don't do on-body carry outside of their vehicles.

 

[chris.jackson]

I don't want to keep a copy of anybody's ID with their actual DOB on it, nor their SSN.
(Neither a driver's license nor a GWL has the SSN on it, anyway, right?)
Keeping that information is a potential liability for me.
If it were stolen from me, by hacking or burglary or something, it certainly COULD be used in identity theft and other fraud.
So I'd rather not even possess that level of personal information on folks I buy, sell, or trade guns with.

I'll LOOK at the ID cards, but not copy them and save the copies.
Looking allows me to say I did my "due diligence" without creating issues of identity theft.

Never even thought about that aspect but even more reason.

We have enough laws on the books without people making up nonexistent ones. If they would enforce what's there already, there's more than enough to cover just about every issue.

 

[EugenFJR]

Oh good, this again.

As if the other 372 threads on this very same subject, were not enough...

 

[Realstudent368]

Bravo....