Talking to Police after a Self Defense Incident

[spencer60]

Brother with 25 years experience on the street then up through the ranks to command says, "Never, ever talk to the police. They aren't you're friends and they aren't there to help you."

That's great advice if you are a criminal. There is literally nothing a criminal can say that will help his case... because he's guilty.

In a valid self-defense case though, you are innocent. You are the victim, and that's what this whole 'say nothing at all' mindset misses. That video above is aimed at CRIMINALS. People who really committed the crime they are being questioned about. Most police are used to dealing with criminals who say nothing, and if you do that they will almost automatically put you in that same category.

On the other hand, if you describe the basics of what happened ("I was attacked by that man, he had that gun, those people there saw the attack") and politely tell the police that you will gladly give a full statement once you have had a chance to speak with your lawyer, they won't be pegging you as a criminal.... After all, criminals don't point out evidence and witnesses, or offer to make a full statement.

I'm also not really sure about hanging up on 911.

If you are in public I would think you would want to stay on the line no matter what, just to make sure that the dispatcher can act as a relay between you and the approaching officers. You need to make sure they have a good description of you, and are aware that you are the victim here, not the attacker. Simply being on the phone with 911 helps establish this.

You don't have to answer any questions the dispatcher asks, just keep it to where you are, what you look like like and that you were attacked. As mentioned above, those calls are recorded, so you do want to keep it to the bare minimum.

If you disconnect the call, the cops will be rolling up and see a guy standing over a guy bleeding out on the ground, and probably treat you like the attacker. You won't be able to hand them the phone and ask them to verify with dispatch that you called them. That the man lying in a pool of blood is the actual attacker.

 

[palmettomoon]

There is no innocent, only guilty or not guilty.

 

[MRH]

Here's some good solid advice

 

[GAgunLAWbooklet]

skipping 7 pages and jumping right from the OP to this:

If you don't say anything to the cops, how are they going to know it's a clear-cut self-defense case?
Generally, when cops find a person dead on the ground and somebody else standing over them with a gun, the shooter gets charged with murder, booked into jail, and held without bond pending a bond hearing in a week or so. The bond will be $50,000 to half a million bucks, and if you use a bail bonding service they'll charge 12% as a non-refundable fee. Then, you'll have to start shopping for a lawyer. If you are poor, you'll get an overworked public defender, and you'll be one of 300 clients he or she has at that time. If you do not qualify for a P.D., then a private practice attorney will probably want at least ten thousand dollars up front as a retainer to even start working on your defense.

The only reason this doesn't normally happen is that good guys who shoot bad guys DON'T FOLLOW the internet know-it-all's advice about not talking to cops, at all, ever, right after a self-defense incident.

They usually relate their self-defense story, at least the short version, and that is what cops use to dispel "probable cause" that the shooter committed a felony crime.

I say if it's a good shoot, tell the cops so in a couple of short sentences and then stop. Don't go into a lot of detail and don't give them the long version of the story. Save that for another day after you've had time to calm down and meet a lawyer.

 

[GAgunLAWbooklet]

P.S. if you realize it could be seen as a bad shoot, or you think you'll get prosecuted for political reasons unrelated to your guilt or innocence, THEN don't talk. Not at all. Invoke your right to counsel and your right to remain silent. Expect this to piss the cops off and throw the book at you. It will certainly make your life harder in the short term, but it's the best way to avoid getting a conviction down the road a few years when this goes to trial.

 

[medium187mph]

Anything you say CAN AND WILL BE USED AGAINST YOU......

Activate your 5th and politely decline to speak and request a lawyer or have one on standby.

 

[AKradr]

Remember everything is recorded. From your 911 call asking for help. Think about it, do you want to be on the phone saying "I just shot someone". Or would it be better to say "I was the victim of a crime and there has been a shooting, send the police and an ambulance to this location."

In a shooting you need to notify the authorities. You don't want to say anything without the advice of a lawyer. You need to tell them how many shooting victims there are and if the situation is under control. Dispatchers will flip to a chart and start asking a series of questions. Questions you may not want recorded.

Hang up the phone and turn your phone off. Get your thoughts together. If you stay on the phone they will continue to ask questions. Remember these are questions you may not want your recorded answers played out in court. Remember George Zimmerman? His phone call to the dispatcher was used to try and establish motive and discrimination.

To the first officer on scene. "I was in fear for my life and I'm pretty shook up now, want my attorney present before I answer any questions."

Mentally prepare to be arrested and spending the next couple days in jail before a public defender can be arranged.

When I went through LEO training more than 30 years ago in California. The Sergeant giving the training had been involved in several (to the best of my recollection it was 7) on the job shootings. The Sergeant's advice to the police recruits was when asked what happened, to assert your 5th amendment against self incrimination and refuse to answer any questions.

Yes, an on duty police officer involved in an on duty shooting advised to invoke the 5th.

He went on to say that as an officer they would acknowledge his invoking his rights, and then say OK, now tell us what happened.

As a civilian, the only safe thing to do is lawyer up and chill out in a cell. Because anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law.

The police will try to make you talk. They will harass and play all kinds of games to try to make you respond. At that point the only response should be "What part of "I want my attorney present before I answer any questions," don't you understand? If they continue to harass you be sure to get their name and badge number.

Why does your plan only include you and not take into account loved ones that may have been seriously injured during the incident? I don't want to sit in a jail cell for several days while someone I care about is in the hospital after a clear case of self defense.

I also wouldn't want to hear from my attorney after I bond out that the police already got a statement from the dead perps cooperative girlfriend/boo and the police and D.A. don't need mine, they know what happened from witnesses and evidence from the scene. There is no requirement to obtain a statement from you at all, it's just more paperwork.

Why would the police try to make you talk when it's easier to obtain statements from all those cooperative "witnesses"? If the first words you say to a responding officer are "I want an attorney" they will simply ignore you while you sit in the back of a dirty patrol vehicle and you become a spectator to your future.

 

[rockyfatcat]

Why does your plan only include you and not take into account loved ones that may have been seriously injured during the incident? I don't want to sit in a jail cell for several days while someone I care about is in the hospital after a clear case of self defense.

I also wouldn't want to hear from my attorney after I bond out that the police already got a statement from the dead perps cooperative girlfriend/boo and the police and D.A. don't need mine, they know what happened from witnesses and evidence from the scene. There is no requirement to obtain a statement from you at all, it's just more paperwork.

Why would the police try to make you talk when it's easier to obtain statements from all those cooperative "witnesses"? If the first words you say to a responding officer are "I want an attorney" they will simply ignore you while you sit in the back of a dirty patrol vehicle and you become a spectator to your future.

He who acts as his own lawyer has a fool for a client.

If you say nothing, nothing you said can be used against you. There have been several threads on this site that have discussed at length the issues with information given to the police. Do your own research, make your own decisions. Sure you have some valid points. But remember that the police aren't your friends and something you say in an adrenaline filled state can and will be used against you.

Why would an on duty officer involved in an on duty shooting be trained to invoke their 5th amendment rights?

 

[Ken Ford]

He who acts as his own lawyer has a fool for a client.

If you say nothing, nothing you said can be used against you. There have been several threads on this site that have discussed at length the issues with information given to the police. Do your own research, make your own decisions. Sure you have some valid points. But remember that the police aren't your friends and something you say in an adrenaline filled state can and will be used against you.

Why would an on duty officer involved in an on duty shooting be trained to invoke their 5th amendment rights?

They are not. They have a different set of rights called Garrity Rights. They don't have the option to plead the fifth, unless there is a criminal investigation from the start. Doesn't protect them in the case of a criminal charge.

 

[rockyfatcat]

They are not. They have a different set of rights called Garrity Rights. They don't have the option to plead the fifth, unless there is a criminal investigation from the start. Doesn't protect them in the case of a criminal charge.

You may very well be absolutely right. My information is from training in California and from over 30 years ago.

One of my friends from back home was an assistant district attorney in Los Angeles. He was known for his ability to perform miracles when it came to "creative report writing"

In any situation a certain amount of sh*t happens. What you say in a report requires a certain amount of brevity and editing.

As a civilian involved in a shooting. A remark or statement misspoken or intentionally misconstrued by investigators can land you in Geoge Zimmermans shoes.

The police may employ a tactic to provoke a response to make you say something you may regret.

Anything you say can and will used against you in a court of law. Many people have written statements that later turned around and bit them in the ass.

Hey it's your life, roll the dice. What's the worst that could happen?